Non-linearity of dosing and pharmacokinetics

[ftv10hb]

Yes, here is the epitalon study - https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/40908429/

For Melanotan-2, I have heard of kidney damage as a side effect, but I believe it occurs at higher doses. I am not much familiar, so you should check things out. Here are two important papers -

1. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23121206/
2. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7148395/

Thank you! I will definitely look into them

 

[buffoon24]

Also if you have a link to the above mentioned phase 1 trial of mots c in humans I would like it . I looked a week ago to see if there was anything and did not find it , only a study of a modified version of mots c in humans.

Yes sir, there you go - https://www.globenewswire.com/news-...1-Under-Development-for-NASH-and-Obesity.html
The drug they are talking about (CB4211) is a MOTS-C analog

 

[buffoon24]

Thank you for telling us the exciting news qqqaabout the epithalon study replicating the results! I have not come across that despite my attempts to search. Would you happen to be able to have a link, the text, or a copy of that paper?

This whole subject is quite interesting. I hage always assumed that people titrate slowly to effect, though I assume that diminishing returns is accepted because of i creased returns obtainable in no other eay (easily). And in subtle peps, placebo might obscure true effects of increasing dose…
Do you have some good examples of reversal? Or any peptides you suspect that of?

Epitalon is definitely quite interesting! It is one of those too good to be true kind of peptides BUT almost all the research is from Khavinson's St. Petersburg lab.

 

[buffoon24]

great post! i appreciate the depth of information you provided as well as the list of sources you used. would you mind sharing where you found that increasing glp-1s dosage fall under the category of diminishing returns? i apologize if this is among the list of sources you have, i haven’t had the time to peruse through all of them yet.

These are good papers to look at for the dose response - https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2107519 https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2206038
Note that these studies are not studying dose response as the main thing, but they have looked at how primary outcomes change across 3 different dosing regimen

 

[Chili777]

Yes, here is the epitalon study - https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/40908429/

For Melanotan-2, I have heard of kidney damage as a side effect, but I believe it occurs at higher doses. I am not much familiar, so you should check things out. Here are two important papers -

1. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23121206/
2. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7148395/

That was the second one I posted above. I hadn't seen anything more recent. I hope they keep doing proper research on it.

 

[Labcat]

Thank you for telling us the exciting news qqqaabout the epithalon study replicating the results! I have not come across that despite my attempts to search. Would you happen to be able to have a link, the text, or a copy of that paper?

This whole subject is quite interesting. I hage always assumed that people titrate slowly to effect, though I assume that diminishing returns is accepted because of i creased returns obtainable in no other eay (easily). And in subtle peps, placebo might obscure true effects of increasing dose…
Do you have some good examples of reversal? Or any peptides you suspect that o

Epitalon is definitely quite interesting! It is one of those too good to be true kind of peptides BUT almost all the research is from Khavinson's St. Petersburg lab.

Epitalon is definitely quite interesting! It is one of those too good to be true kind of peptides BUT almost all the research is from Khavinson's St. Petersburg lab.

Some of those papers are visible to us. I’m trying to read some of them. But sometimes work done in countries where scientific advancement is by political influence can be more difficult to get an understanding of whether it’s objective. I don’t have specific information about this context, but I know a lot of highly promoted health research coming out of east germany was not as represented.

 

[Chili777]

Some of those papers are visible to us. I’m trying to read some of them. But sometimes work done in countries where scientific advancement is by political influence can be more difficult to get an understanding of whether it’s objective. I don’t have specific information about this context, but I know a lot of highly promoted health research coming out of east germany was not as represented.

The research we both cited was done in the UK. Here is the full article.

 

[Labcat]

The research we both cited was done in the UK. Here is the full article.

Yes, the cell culture telomere elongation study was done in the UK, sorry, my mind had already skittered along to the oft referred to Khavinson studies for longevity

I was more thinking of the Khavinson Epitalon Thymulin 6 year human study where it appeared to decrease mortality factor of 4 in one group treated for 6 years. The question that immediately arises in my mind is whether the individuals who got 6 years of treatment were the ones who survived or were those not lost to followup. This startlingly not uncommon reversal of cause and effect was seen in a few studies testing long covid treatments. They may have done everything copecetic though, it’s just that I’d feel more confident about their science if I could see more than their conclusions.

Peptides of pineal gland and thymus prolong human life - PubMed

The obtained data confirmed the high geroprotective efficacy of Thymalin and Epithalamin and the expediency of their application in medicine and social care for health maintenance and age-related pathology prevention in persons over 60 to prolong their active longevity.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[HereKittyKitty]

Thank you for everyone's comments. I have been thinking about this for nearly 2 weeks.