Hgh OR Tesa OR Cjc/ipa

jimmyjames01

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38 year old male, been going to the gym constantly for about 2 years.
Been on Reta for about 6 weeks now and down to 81kg. Sitting around 12-15% body fat.

I want to add in some other peptides now to assist with gaining lean muscle.
Would you recommend microdosing HGH due to my age, or just adding tesa or CJC/Ipa to my daily peptides?
For anyone that is taking HGH, what is your daily microdose amount?
 
jimmyjames01 said:
38 year old male, been going to the gym constantly for about 2 years.
Been on Reta for about 6 weeks now and down to 81kg. Sitting around 12-15% body fat.

I want to add in some other peptides now to assist with gaining lean muscle.
Would you recommend microdosing HGH due to my age, or just adding tesa or CJC/Ipa to my daily peptides?
For anyone that is taking HGH, what is your daily microdose amount?
Click to expand...
Neither. If you're happy with the bf% and want lean muscle solely, GH and its secretagogues are not the way to go. There are other methods and depending on goals, constraints, price willing to pay, etc, it would change.
 
WIthout moving into heavy anabolic steroids (although I am trying to get onto Trt, but that will also just be microdosing), what are some better ideas? Money is not an issue
 
There are no peptides that do anything substantial for muscle growth. Think creatine levels of advantage not steroids. Maybe a very small boost but something that woild be very hard to measure. HGH may do a little more, but unless you're deficient, low does probably won't do much and as you crank it up, side effects become pretty ugly.

I would say there are no short cuts, but there are, they are called steriods, and they ain't great for ya. If you have been training hard for two years, you're past the newbie gains stage and its just grinding it out. Your probably looking at 2-5 lbs of muscle gain a year but that adds up over time. Keep training and you'll get there.
 
There's also PEG-MGF, follistatin, epicatechin, and clen combo. I'll be taking it myself when I reach Reta maintenance dose. Then use creatine, whey protein alpha, with Myotor and velositol, with glutamine. You could also look at Testagen, enclomiphene
 
jimmyjames01 said:
WIthout moving into heavy anabolic steroids (although I am trying to get onto Trt, but that will also just be microdosing), what are some better ideas? Money is not an issue
Click to expand...
What do you mean micro dosing? Do you mean just actual TRT rather than "TRT+?" I wouldn't use a smaller than TRT dose and risk shutting down my natural levels.
 
HGH is probably the best option without going into steroids. High dose, not 1-2iu, more like 4-6iu, as side effects permit. Managing the water retention and associated joint pain is the worse part, but many people have no trouble with that.

Microdosing does nothing other than suppress and replace your natural production - congrats you spent money for zero net effect.

HGH is useful to me because it allows recomp, I can slowly gain strength and muscle without getting too fat. It also allows for efficient weight cuts, preserving muscle during weight loss. In the long term, talking years here, it will have a significant effect on your body composition. In the short term, you just gotta have faith and stick to it.
 
You can run HCG at a reasonable dose for a little while to boost your test without cutting your natural levels. And if you ever get on TRT it'll be a good thing to have experience with. 125IU every other day or so. Some people just mix HCG with enclo and skip the TRT altogether while achieving 1000+ levels, though I don't know how they manage E2.

Bear in mind I don't know that much about hormones, and HCG hasn't seen clinical study being used in this particular manner.
 
Tattoo85 said:
What do you mean micro dosing? Do you mean just actual TRT rather than "TRT+?" I wouldn't use a smaller than TRT dose and risk shutting down my natural levels.
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I plan to take 140 - 150mg test e per week, pinning 20mg daily which is what i meant by microdosing.
 
38 is still quite young; perhaps you can experiment with secretagogues, specifically tesa first if money is not an issue. I've tried CJC no dac / Ipa, and frankly, it (ipa) did nothing but make me ravenously hungry despite being on a moderately high dose of reta. HGH blows all of the secretagogues out of the water, but you'll feel it more if your igf is really low and/or you are just old.

That being said, none of these will build muscle. They can lean you out and make your existing muscles pop more for sure.
 
miameow said:
38 is still quite young; perhaps you can experiment with secretagogues, specifically tesa first if money is not an issue. I've tried CJC no dac / Ipa, and frankly, it (ipa) did nothing but make me ravenously hungry despite being on a moderately high dose of reta. HGH blows all of the secretagogues out of the water, but you'll feel it more if your igf is really low and/or you are just old.

That being said, none of these will build muscle. They can lean you out and make your existing muscles pop more for sure.
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Eh... average expected lifespan of a male is 76, so he's technically half-way now (speaking as a 46yo 😉)

I plan to take 140 - 150mg test e per week, pinning 20mg daily which is what i meant by microdosing.
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Yeah, that's split dosing as @Gr33dyOctopus already stated.
Have you done any bloodwork to see what your current hormone panel is (both test and gh/igf1)?

Just saying that if you inject only 140-150 a week you might just end up with the same (possibly even worse) test level that you might have right now. (I've seen levels between 600 - 900 on such dosages). Meaning, you'll only mess up your endocrine system and don't get any benefits.

Also...
Going to the gym for 2 years means you're still a beginner with a shitload of potential 'n00bGainz' in the tank. There's absolutely no need to use any compounds to aid your muscle growth at this moment.

My advice:
Really lock-in for another 2-3 years 'natty' with a good training plan and a few (lean)bulk and cut cycles and then re-evaluate.
 
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jimmyjames01 said:
38 year old male, been going to the gym constantly for about 2 years.
Been on Reta for about 6 weeks now and down to 81kg. Sitting around 12-15% body fat.

I want to add in some other peptides now to assist with gaining lean muscle.
Would you recommend microdosing HGH due to my age, or just adding tesa or CJC/Ipa to my daily peptides?
For anyone that is taking HGH, what is your daily microdose amount?
Click to expand...

Hey brother, we both 38! I'm currently on a similar level, 205lbs at 13%ish body fat. I've been on Cjc/Ipa for about 3 weeks now AND IGF-1 LR3 roughly around the same period and I do notice a difference in lean body mass retention, better recovery and fuller body.

I've done comprehensive research and studies regarding HGH and Anavar (the least riskiest but weakest steroid) and I have to say that if you're an overall healthy individual and where you're at now, don't take roids... At least not yet. I would strongly recommend you do your due diligence before taking on something you may know little about. The potential consequences, some of them are irreversible... Also, anavar is the most faked roid on the market - many products are sold as anavar but are really watered down dianobol or HCG/HGH combos.... If you do decide to research and get it, make sure you get it from a reputable source OR where a recent COA is available. If it's janoshik (gold standard), then make sure you double check to see if that report is genuine on janoshik site and not copy/pasted or "edited".

HGH would be the best option for you. It has a host of benefits as well as a few side effects but if you dose properly, as in low dosing first couple weeks then titrating slowly up, you should be okay. One thing to note, you won't see any real muscle gains until you're at least a month in (HGH is taken long term; between 6-12 months). In the early stages you'll definitely feel better, get some better sleep and recovery will be faster.

If you're looking for faster results, go with what @Smiter says and take PEG-MGF (targeted), IGF-1 LR3 (systemic) but don't go his route of the other ones. 🤣 🤣

I'll start HGH tomorrow and start to ween off CJC/IPA and IGF-1 both and completely stop in about 2 weeks; will be replaced completely by HGH. They all work a little differently, but I again, safety matters more for me than risking it all.

I would recommend get your blood work done FIRST (fitomicslabs.com) to see where your levels are at now. Then take HGH at 1iu/day for 2-3 weeks first to assess tolerability, then titrate up by 1 every few weeks until you hit 4iu/day (safer dosing). Anything above 4 a day and you're going to start taking in the other side effects.

If you're looking for a reputable source for HGH, Lobster. But you could also DM me and I'll steer you in the right direction.
 
dancs said:
go with what @Smiter says and take PEG-MGF (targeted), IGF-1 LR3 (systemic) but don't go his route of the other ones
Click to expand...
??????????? Por que, dancs, why? Why you do me in like that? After all these years, all the playboy we exchanged, all the sheep we shagged, all the cops we drove nuts, and one time a chick says she'd rather have my baby than yours, you go ballistic??? Bros before 304s, dude. It's good you're gonna take HGH. You can finally grow up.

Oh yeah, I would never recommend IGF-LR, I mentioned IGF-DES
 
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Appreciate all the advice given.

Current bloods as of 2 weeks ago:

Free T - 369 pmo/L
T - 11 nmo/L

Low, but infortunately not low enough for a dr in Aus to prescribe TRT
 
DrPEPr said:
Eh... average expected lifespan of a male is 76, so he's technically half-way now (speaking as a 46yo 😉)


Yeah, that's split dosing as @Gr33dyOctopus already stated.
Have you done any bloodwork to see what your current hormone panel is (both test and gh/igf1)?

Just saying that if you inject only 140-150 a week you might just end up with the same (possibly even worse) test level that you might have right now. (I've seen levels between 600 - 900 on such dosages). Meaning, you'll only mess up your endocrine system and don't get any benefits.

Also...
Going to the gym for 2 years means you're still a beginner with a shitload of potential 'n00bGainz' in the tank. There's absolutely no need to use any compounds to aid your muscle growth at this moment.

My advice:
Really lock-in for another 2-3 years 'natty' with a good training plan and a few (lean)bulk and cut cycles and then re-evaluate.
Click to expand...
To each their own but this logic does not reflect the experiences of my RS or those around them at all. If your T is not naturally at an optimal level and you are approaching 40, a small dose of T 140-150 per week can double if not triple your levels. Combine that with low natural igf1 levels and you are stunted on your progress regardless of your regimen. Supplementing your T production is a long term decision for sure, but low levels of supplementation does not destroy your endocrine system as dramatically as mainstream media portays. If you start blasting extreme amounts then you are playing with fire, but the name of the game is optimization here and trt + tesa can absolutely optimize your hormones. 2 years of hard work is not really a beginner in my book either, ive seen people go from 0-hero in that amount of time. Just my 2c
 
I should elaborate on the 2 years, have been weightlifting most my life on and off. The last 2 years have just been more locked in, with not missing a session for the last year, eating mostly on point throughout bulks and cuts.

Last 4-5 months, i have just hit a platteau that i cannot break. I did make a mistake with Reta and using too much, too quick. Large hit to my weights and muscle that I am trying to re-gain currently.

I wouldnt say I look like a beginner lifter tho and definitely know my way around the gym. Anabolics is all just new to me.
 
Smiter said:
Then use creatine, whey protein alpha, with Myotor and velositol, with glutamine. You could also look at Testagen, enclomiphene
Click to expand...
jimmyjames01 said:
I should elaborate on the 2 years, have been weightlifting most my life on and off. The last 2 years have just been more locked in, with not missing a session for the last year, eating mostly on point throughout bulks and cuts.

Last 4-5 months, i have just hit a platteau that i cannot break. I did make a mistake with Reta and using too much, too quick. Large hit to my weights and muscle that I am trying to re-gain currently.

I wouldnt say I look like a beginner lifter tho and definitely know my way around the gym. Anabolics is all just new to me.
Click to expand...
I would not use HGH unless I had to. TRT itself I wouldnt want to, but still better than HGH. IGF-1 DES could help you out as well as MGF. Just make sure you cycle the latter two, and never use them concurrently. If you want to break the plateau, think about using something you haven't. I mean some non-steroidal supplements.
 
Smiter said:
I would not use HGH unless I had to. TRT itself I wouldnt want to, but still better than HGH. IGF-1 DES could help you out as well as MGF. Just make sure you cycle the latter two, and never use them concurrently. If you want to break the plateau, think about using something you haven't. I mean some non-steroidal supplements.
Click to expand...
I Currently use most non anabolic supps, creatine, whey, bcaas.
HGH i am still on the fence with, a lot of people just saying it supplements test well.
From my research and bloods, test E is definitely something i want to start for TRT.

Why IGF, over tesa and cjc/ipa?

And MGF i have never heard of but will look into.
 
jimmyjames01 said:
I Currently use most non anabolic supps, creatine, whey, bcaas.
HGH i am still on the fence with, a lot of people just saying it supplements test well.
From my research and bloods, test E is definitely something i want to start for TRT.

Why IGF, over tesa and cjc/ipa?

And MGF i have never heard of but will look into.
Click to expand...
Get the GNC Wheybolic Alpha and thank me later.
Sure GH supplements Test. They are both anabolic, but the sides are the issue. GH causes water retention and bloat, and if I remember you wanna cut weight right? break your plateau?
The anabolic effect of GH is achieved through IGF action anyway. Tesa/cjc/ipa/their mother/whoever are secretagogues of HGH. So the end result of all of them for muscle building aspect is to use somatomedin aka IGF. Why bother if you can take IGF straight up? About Test, enanthate, cypionate and propionate are the most sought after esters, but I would stay off for as long as possible. You can use enclomiphene, Testagen, etc if you wanna try boosting your natural production.
And MGF is best used as pEG MGF for long lasting effects. Mechano Growth Factor. It's the synthesized version of IGF that focuses on muscle building with minimal effect on blood sugar.
Here is the AI bit on it.
PEG-MGF (Pegylated Mechano-Growth Factor) is a synthetic peptide derived from IGF-1. It is designed to repair tissue and promote muscle growth. By attaching polyethylene glycol (PEG) to the molecule, scientists bypass the short half-life of natural MGF, allowing it to remain active in the bloodstream for up to 72 hours.
artgerecht +3

How It Works & Key Benefits
  • Satellite Cell Activation: It promotes the activation and division of satellite cells, which fuse with damaged muscle fibers to repair tears and build muscle.
  • Tissue Repair: It is used in studies researching recovery from exercise, severe injuries, and conditions like sarcopenia.
  • Systemic vs. Local:Unlike standard MGF, which acts locally and degrades in minutes, PEG-MGF travels systemically to repair multiple muscle groups over days



Research & Safety Considerations
  • Regulation: PEG-MGF is classified as a performance-enhancing substance by the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) and is prohibited for athletes in competitive sports.
  • Scientific Status: The majority of data on PEG-MGF is drawn from animal or in-vitro laboratory studies. It is largely sold as a "Research Use Only" (RUO) compound and lacks human clinical trials for general health or performance.
  • Side Effects: Potential side effects observed in research models include fluid retention, tingling or numbness at the injection site, and potential interactions with natural insulin levels.
 
Smiter said:
Get the GNC Wheybolic Alpha and thank me later.
Sure GH supplements Test. They are both anabolic, but the sides are the issue. GH causes water retention and bloat, and if I remember you wanna cut weight right? break your plateau?
The anabolic effect of GH is achieved through IGF action anyway. Tesa/cjc/ipa/their mother/whoever are secretagogues of HGH. So the end result of all of them for muscle building aspect is to use somatomedin aka IGF. Why bother if you can take IGF straight up? About Test, enanthate, cypionate and propionate are the most sought after esters, but I would stay off for as long as possible. You can use enclomiphene, Testagen, etc if you wanna try boosting your natural production.
And MGF is best used as pEG MGF for long lasting effects. Mechano Growth Factor. It's the synthesized version of IGF that focuses on muscle building with minimal effect on blood sugar.
Here is the AI bit on it.
PEG-MGF (Pegylated Mechano-Growth Factor) is a synthetic peptide derived from IGF-1. It is designed to repair tissue and promote muscle growth. By attaching polyethylene glycol (PEG) to the molecule, scientists bypass the short half-life of natural MGF, allowing it to remain active in the bloodstream for up to 72 hours.
artgerecht +3

How It Works & Key Benefits
  • Satellite Cell Activation: It promotes the activation and division of satellite cells, which fuse with damaged muscle fibers to repair tears and build muscle.
  • Tissue Repair: It is used in studies researching recovery from exercise, severe injuries, and conditions like sarcopenia.
  • Systemic vs. Local:Unlike standard MGF, which acts locally and degrades in minutes, PEG-MGF travels systemically to repair multiple muscle groups over days


Research & Safety Considerations
  • Regulation: PEG-MGF is classified as a performance-enhancing substance by the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) and is prohibited for athletes in competitive sports.
  • Scientific Status: The majority of data on PEG-MGF is drawn from animal or in-vitro laboratory studies. It is largely sold as a "Research Use Only" (RUO) compound and lacks human clinical trials for general health or performance.
  • Side Effects: Potential side effects observed in research models include fluid retention, tingling or numbness at the injection site, and potential interactions with natural insulin levels.
Click to expand...
What about anavar?
 
Smiter said:
Enjoy
Click to expand...
I did some research though I think I did alot.... But Anavar is supposedly the least riskiest roid on the market right now, but understandably, the weakest/slowest accumulation, right?

I'm about to start HGH tomorrow so I was going to ween off of LR3 and CJC/IPA blend in the next 2 weeks. OR I can start anavar when it comes in this Wednesday and stop LR3, CJC/IPA altogether?

What's the right move?
 
dancs said:
But Anavar is supposedly the least riskiest roid on the market right now, but understandably, the weakest/slowest accumulation, right?
Click to expand...
It is the least riskiest, but it is NOT the weakest or the slowest accumulation. Look at the ratio pics..The more anabolic something is, the stronger it is. Testosterone is 100 on the scale for anabolic and androgenic effect. Anavar is at least three times more anabolic than testosterone. I have taken only two tabs so far and already I can feel the clear changes.
 
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