For Science! (reta + stacking)

[psycho_driver]

I'll be briefly testing out some non GLP-1 compounds for weight loss along-side reta and documenting the results, both tangible and how I felt while using them, in this thread. I'm a 48yo male who has spent most of my life fat-fit. I have never stopped playing sports since childhood. I've gone through periods where I've been in great shape and capable of putting up impressive numbers in the gym, but mostly I've cruised along at 30-40lbs overweight.

Here's a brief breakdown of my GLP-1 journey this year. Got back from family vacation on 6/20/25. Started compounded tirzepatide from Brello. Starting weight was 251lbs. I think I started at their recommended dosing which is somewhat close to the recommended name brand dosing. By August 1st I was 235.9lbs. Switched over to reta at 1mg 2x per week for 2 weeks, then 2mg 2x per week for the next two weeks. Workout routine of fairly heavy circuit lifting 3x12 across 10 exercises 3x per week locked in. I get 15k+ steps almost every day. I'm doing pretty good keeping added sugars out of my diet and getting 2/3 of my weight in protein. Also doing pretty good with hydration and electrolytes. I start taking MOTS-C and it's quite noticeable for me at the dose I land on, 2.5mg 2x per week. About a week later I added in methylene blue at 4mg per day, it is also a noticeable little bump in energy.

September 1st I weighed 228.2lbs. I still had some of the Brello tirzepatide so I switched to dosing tirzepatide 3.3mg Wednesday afternoons with reta 2.1mg Sunday mornings. Sometime around here I start taking SLU at ~1mg 2x per day. Within a week I'm taking ~2mg 2x per day. Not super noticeable, though my intra-set cooldown times are improved while working out. I finish four weeks on MOTS-C so decide to take time off and start up SS-31 at 1mg daily. Don't notice a thing from it. Try some higher doses, up to I think 5mg daily, still don't notice and effect from it. Strength increasing slowly in gym, slower than I would have been gaining for similar work in my younger days.

October 1st I weighed 224.5lbs. I had recently added in injectable 5-amino-1mq and doing 1mg 2x per day. As the month went on I'd go up to 2mg 2x per day, and tried a few larger doses because as with SS-31, I wasn't really feeling any difference with it. NAD+ precursors had never really done much for me either though. At this point I'm hoping the 5-amino-1mq will help keep me from hitting a complete stall. I'm still doing the tirz/reta split, I switched from a 12mg to 15mg vial of reta and my dosing goes up to 2.25mg per shot.

Early in October I get my last blood work as of now. All positive changes from early July to then. A1C 6.1 -> 5.4. LDL ~160 -> ~140. Trigs ~145 -> ~110. HDL up a few points. Liver enzymes 70-80 down to into normal range for the first time I've ever seen. My hematocrit had been at the highest point of normal in July so I had donated, still down a couple of points here. Had a couple of inflammation markers checked and it turns out I had low systemic inflammation. My fasted insulin was 14.x and per the formula you find online I was at 3.0 on the insulin resistance scale, the lowest point of the 'significant' category. Hoping to further improve this.

I also wore a portable ECG throughout October since I ocassionally have Wolff-Parkinson-White like episodes. Because of this, I stopped supplementation with anything that could affect my cardio system outside of the GLP-1s. I wrapped up SS-31 early in the month (still nothing noticeable). Stopped a lot of my OTC supplementation such as berberine and methylene blue. I also let my diet slide back to something more like the normal for me. A lot more carbs. A lot more cheat days (maybe cheat weeks). Ate a bunch of Halloween Candy. Decide to embark on this experiment sometime during the month and start planning it out/obtaining the compounds.

November 1st I weighed 222.7. Honestly I was happy to have lost any weight since I wasn't trying at all during October. Note: On my home scale, which is what I'll be doing the weekly comparisons on, I weighed 221.8, which is probably pretty accurate since i weigh there in my underwear. The formal weight number is from an InBody. I was also dropping 2% bodyfat per month up until October, where it said I went up 0.1%. I finished my tirzepatide supply right at the end of the month. Keep in mind, this will mean there will be some lingering tirzepatide in my serum along with the reta for most of November.

Here's the supplementation I will be using through November with these compounds. The supplementation I'm adding in that wasn't present in September marked as new:
Berberine 800mg AM (optionally PM as well if I've had a lot of sugar)
Nicotinamide Riboside 500mg AM on the days I take 5-amino-1mq (until supply runs out, ~10 days)
SLU-PP-332 ~10mg 2x per day sublingual
Urolithin A 500mg 2x per day with SLU (new)
CoQ10 200mg 2x per day with SLU
HMB (free acid) 3g per day
Zinc 30mg per day AM (new)
Boron 10mg per day AM (new)
Tongkat Ali 200mg per day AM (new)
Multivitamin gummy daily AM
Shilajit 300mg per day AM (newish, switched from paste in Aug to capsule)
Ginseng 50mg per day AM (new)
Tumeric 25mg per day AM (newish, switched from gummy to capsule)
1 scoop of colostrum
Taurine 1g AM
Vitamin E 90mg per day AM (new)
Lutein 20mg per day AM (new)
Zeaxanthin 2mg per day AM (new)
Astaxanthin 6mg per day AM (new)
MOTS-C 2.5mg 2x per week
Melanotan II ~320mcg 2x per week
5-amino-1mq 1mg 2x per day 5 on/2 off
kisspeptin-10 100mcg 2x per day (new) 5 on/2 off
Omega 3 fatty acids 1040mg PM
Every night a bedtime tea with:
Citrus Bergamot ~750mg
Creatine 5g
Magnesium citrate 500mg
Taurine 1g
Ashwagandha Root ~750mg
Glycine 1g

Here are my baseline numbers from October that I will be comparing against throughout November. Most of these are provided via an AmazFit Helio Strap worn on the bicep.

Average blood pressure: 124/81
Average resting heart rate: 67
Average HRV: 28
Average sleep score: 68
Average stress score: 37
Ending weight: 221.8

 

[psycho_driver]

My first week of experimentation was with 7mg nicotine patches. What I expected: very mild metabolic rate increase. Increased blood pressure. Maybe some mental benefits.

I have never had a smoking habit. Experimented as a dorky teenager but fortunately it never got its hooks in me.

I upped my first reta dose of the month to 3mg and plan on riding 3mg 2x per week down to my goal weight of 199.9. I experienced the itchy skin feeling for the first time ever but it was pretty mild and went away after 12 hours or so.

Diet pretty much back on point. I am not pedantic enough to track calories but I'm pretty confident I'm hitting the 1700-2000 daily range. Cutting sugars back down. Didn't do great with hydration this week.

Here are the data for the week:
Average blood pressure: 117/72 (unexpected)
Average resting heart rate: 68
Average HRV: 28%
Average sleep score: 66
Average amount of deep sleep: 27% (I couldn't pull a monthly average for October but I feel it would have been 29-30%)
Average stress score: 37
Ending weight: 219.8 (-2lbs)

I slept with the patches on. The amount of sleep has dropped a little. I haven't gotten over 7 hours in 4 or 5 days. No major side effects, though I think I have been a little more irritable the past couple of days, and expect to be irritable with the removal of the nicotine from my system. I missed 2 days of blood pressure recording. I try to do that later in the evening closer to bedtime. Surprised that my numbers were lower.

I do believe the nicotine helped with mental focus a bit. Overall not a bad experience. I definitely wouldn't recommend to anyone who has overcome a nicotine addiction as it might cause you to relapse into your old habit.

Speaking of sleeping with the patches on--I was talking to a co-worker about my experiment and he said that his prior company (Pepsi) had launched an initiative where they bought nicotine patches for their employees who wanted to quit smoking. He said that 2 out of 6 of his co-workers that he knew who tried the patches experienced night terrors while wearing them. Just an interesting anecdotal tidbit I thought I'd throw in.

Week 2 will be with Mirabegron. I actually look forward to this one to see if it will stop the nightly necessity to get up mid-sleep to pee.

 

[Nathanologist]

I think documenting research metrics and progress is one of the more valuable things we can add to this community. Thank you for taking the time to do it. I especially appreciate your adding new supplements progressively rather than all at once. That’s quite a stack!

Note that your placeholders are a good idea, but at some arbitrary deadline your ability to edit a post is removed.

 

[psycho_driver]

I think documenting research metrics and progress is one of the more valuable things we can add to this community. Thank you for taking the time to do it. I especially appreciate your adding new supplements progressively rather than all at once. That’s quite a stack!

Note that your placeholders are a good idea, but at some arbitrary deadline your ability to edit a post is removed.

Thanks for the heads up about the ability to edit disappearing after a short time! I've removed the placeholder posts and will just post updates from week to week.

 

[Jellybelly54]

Thank you for your very thoughtful post. I can tell that you are committed to doing everything you can to lose weight and get healthy. Congratulations on turning your prediabetes around by lowering that hemoglobin A1c! I’m curious what your thoughts are on the KISS? Have you noticed any major Symptoms that you could attribute only to it or has the experience been positive? I hear it is supposed to help with sex drive in men. Have you noticed that improving at all?
I’m just wondering if it would be a good alternative to try before supplementing with testosterone? My free testosterone is 3 which is pretty darn low. I am not sure I want to jump on any gear yet. Trying out a little ipamorelin, but the KISS looks more promising to me? I don’t know? I would love for others to comment on their results on Kisspeptin

 

[psycho_driver]

Thank you for your very thoughtful post. I can tell that you are committed to doing everything you can to lose weight and get healthy. Congratulations on turning your prediabetes around by lowering that hemoglobin A1c! I’m curious what your thoughts are on the KISS? Have you noticed any major Symptoms that you could attribute only to it or has the experience been positive? I hear it is supposed to help with sex drive in men. Have you noticed that improving at all?
I’m just wondering if it would be a good alternative to try before supplementing with testosterone? My free testosterone is 3 which is pretty darn low. I am not sure I want to jump on any gear yet. Trying out a little ipamorelin, but the KISS looks more promising to me? I don’t know? I would love for others to comment on their results on Kisspeptin

With so much polypharma happening its hard to say yet what the kisspeptin is getting up to. I'm on day 2 in week 2 of using it. The past couple of days I've been extremely fatigued. Didn't get days off work last week and it has been a little more strenuous than usual. Or it could be upping the reta dose a little that's causing it. Or the nicotine leaving my system? Or an unexpected side effect from the mirabegron. Who knows!

Anyway, my EQ has been pretty great since starting the kisspeptin. The first couple of days I pinned it I woke up with mega boners both during the night and then in the morning. Despite my extreme fatigue, the wife was feeling frisky earlier this evening so we knocked a session out and the little fella did me proud.

I do intend to get blood work early in December and I'll be having my hormone levels checked to compare against baseline from pre-cycle.

 

[Jellybelly54]

Nice!! You’re cracking me up!!

 

[psycho_driver]

Week 2 with 50mg daily Mirabegron in the books. What I expected: not a whole lot honestly other than maybe a little bump in blood pressure. Hoped I would sleep through the night without needing to get up to pee.

For those unfamiliar, Mirabegron is a prescription medication for bladder incontinence. It works by relaxing the smooth muscle wall of the bladder. What does this have to do with weight loss? Well, it is actually an adrenergic beta 3 receptor agonist. Clenbuterol, which many of you may have heard of, is an adrenergic beta 2 receptor agonist. Use of Mirabegron has shown to 'brown' white adipose tissue (fat, essentially). Browned adipose tissue is more metabolically active than white. A study that gave participants a single 200mg dose of Mirabegron showed that their basal metabolic rate increased enough to burn an extra 200 calories per day.

Unlike its cousin Clenbuterol it doesn't come with the nasty side effects that drug is infamous for unless you raise your dose enough to start having spill-over into the beta 2 receptor range. Notable listed side effects are: increased blood pressure, headaches, constipation (oh joy), dizziness, nausea, dry mouth etc.

The week went okay overall. This was week 2 of my GLP-1 dosing going from 3.3mg tirz and 2.25mg reta to 6mg reta (2x 3mg). I forgot to mention in the original post I'm also doing 0.5mg cagrilintide with every GLP-1 pinning. I've had pretty complete control of my appetite this week. As good as the best weeks I had solely on tirzepatide. My calorie intake would have been similar to last weeks, with the exception that more of it was shifted to earlier in the day since we have a jug of milk near expiration so I've been eating bowls of cereal for breakfast, along with one day of protein waffles.

My sleep has been pretty meh. Still averaging around 7 hours per night. I sleep really hard for about 4 hours, have to get up and pee, and then struggle to get back into a deep sleep. The first two nights coming off of the nicotine patches/starting to take the mirabegron would have posed a challenge getting to sleep in the first place were I a person that struggles with anxiety. Tons of anxious energy just laying there in bed.

I have had more headaches than normal this week, which is a potential side effect of the mirabegron. Also, as you'll see below there was a pretty minor bump in blood pressure, as expected. I was pretty disappointed that I still had to get up every night to pee. I forgot to put my band back on one night after an evening shower and another night the band flipped inside out, so this week only had 5 nights of sleep data available from the Helio.

Average blood pressure: 121/79
Average resting heart rate: 68
Average HRV: 25% (was trending downward through the week, 22% last night)
Average sleep score: 76
Average amount of deep sleep: 29%
Average stress score: 37
Ending weight: 219.0 (-0.8lbs)

So according to the numbers my sleep was a little better than the week on nicotine. Weight loss a little less but FYI I was weighing at 217.x the two mornings leading up to today. Had some chips last night which may have caused a little water retention. Unlike the nicotine, in theory the weight loss benefits from the mirabegron should continue for some time. My HRV was declining over the week which might just be additive stress from all the crap I'm taking like the MOTS-C and SLU-PP-332.

Not directly weight loss related but my testicles got a little tender this week and were maybe a bit swollen. Probably kisspeptin-10 related, and hopefully a positive since I still have 3 weeks of that experiment to go through before blood work for results.

For week 3, provided the USPS doesn't manage to lose the package again between the post office and my house (they lost it for two days between my local distribution center and the post office), I'll be taking 150mg of ATX-304 daily. I'm both excited and a little scared for this one, since it's so new there aren't many anecdotal accounts of its use yet. If I don't post a week 3 summary then you know I died and you probably shouldn't add it into your stack.

 

[psycho_driver]

I survived week 3! I was taking somewhere between 150mg and 300mg ATX-304 daily. I say somewhere between because I just had the raw powder and I figured up 150mg as 1/5 of 1/4 of a teaspoon so I was just eyeballing it on a 1/4 teaspoon measuring spoon and shoveling it into my mouth and washing it down with some water. It's hydrophobic like SLU-PP-332 so it won't mix well with most liquids. The powder doesn't do anything unpleasant to your mouth and doesn't really taste like much of anything.

What I was expecting? I was about 50/50 on whether the stuff was make believe fairy dust. It's pretty new to this space, though the chemical itself has been around for a while (I see studies going back as far as 2015). It was originally O-304 (and you might be more likely to find it for sale under this name) but it changed hands from one pharma development company to another and was renamed when it did so. It's still apparently in human trials, though the latest information of activity I found was from 2023. It's an AMPK activator and it's being trialed for use as a type 2 diabetes drug as well as a drug to treat fatty liver disease (sounds familiar). One of the iffy things about it that made me wonder about its validity is that there is a company out there actively marketing it as a skin care additive. Maybe it's the be-all end-all of drugs? Beautify your skin while melting the pounds away!

It's mode of action is to directly activate your AMPK energy pathway which switches your body from fat storing to fat burning mode. Secondarily (and this one you have to dig a little deeper to find) it is a mild mitochondrial uncoupler. Mitochondrial uncouplers cause disruption to your mitochondria's normal energy production pathway, causing them to freak out and try harder to get that energy released, using up more energy in the process. It's the same way that DNP caused weight loss in people and then cause them to die from burning themselves up from the inside out when they slightly overdosed it. Supposedly this stuff is a lot safer and has safeguards in place to keep you from entering a run-away self immolating condition.

I saw in one of the trials the dosing was 150mg. Hunter Williams has said he's taken up to 600mg at a time, so I figured I'd be okay as long as I kept it below that. Another concern with the drug besides the whole suicide by heat death, is that by keeping your AMPK energy pathway active all the time and leaving the mTOR pathway off you're apparently much more likely to lose lean mass with weight loss.

My experience? Well, I believe I felt more effects from this directly than anything else I've taken thus far. I was taking it mid to late afternoons in place of my second SLU dose. After about an hour I was checking my body temp and it was usually up 0.5-1 degree. My sleep really suffered at first as I had the same experience for the first four or five nights that I had the one time I took a large dose of SLU (~50mg) where I laid down and it felt like my body was vibrating. I now believe this may be how I perceive mitochondrial uncoupling effects, as according to Anthony Castore high dose SLU spillover can cause uncoupling as well.

With my sleep I usually fall asleep pretty quick and get my deep sleep out of the way fairly quick as well. I had restless sleep for at least the first four hours of every night for the first four or five nights. You can see on my sleep tracker how almost all of my metrics gradually improved through the week. Sleeping heart rate, HRV, percentage of deep sleep, etc. I think it was my body already building up a tolerance to the substance. Fortunately I was able to spend a little more time in bed than usual through the week so I didn't suffer too badly from the experiment.

I also had to get up to pee twice every night for those first four or five nights and usually had to pee again upon waking, so apparently it has a diuretic effect as well (I'm a very consistent once-per-night guy). Finally, I switched from a solid six or seven weeks straight of constipation to retarhea on day 7. This may or may not have been related to the ATX-304. Outside of these issues, in my waking hours I didn't notice much of a difference over the week.

So, yeah, I do think this stuff works for weight loss. It's pretty expensive. Gram for gram you can find it for a little less than SLU but if you're not mega-dosing SLU then SLU will offer a lot more bang for your buck.

Here are the metrics for the week:
Average blood pressure: 116/75
Average resting heart rate: 69
Average HRV: 25% (was climbing through the week)
Average sleep score: 73
Average amount of deep sleep: 25%
Average stress score: 35
Ending weight: 215.8 (-3.2lbs)

The first two nights I took KLOW shots along with my wife since I had added 5mg DSIP to the mix and I had never tried it before. It might have effected my sleep those two nights but I don't personally think so. My wife's deep sleep did go up very slightly with that mix.

For week 4 I'll be doing the oldie but goodie (or baddie as many people feel)--Clenbuterol. I chose it for this week because it's a given that it works for weight loss, and since this is the week of Thanksgiving it'd be unfair to try to pit it against the other substances here on a pound-for-pound loss basis because I intend to eat my share of pies and cookies at the end of the week. It'll be more of a report from someone who has never taken it using it along side reta and how it affects my metrics after a week. I will be doing the standard 40mcg daily doses.

 

[4StrandKnot]

Damn interesting. DNP is something I've read quite a bit about. The effects were first observed amongst women working in a WWI munitions factory in France. They had lost quite a bit of weight due to environmental exposure to DNP.

I've been reading about SLUP and SLUP with BAM. Damn interesting, although I suspect the body-vibrating experience would personally freak me out too much.