Pharmacists & Compounders Speak On Shortage, Express Concerns About Research Peptides

[rastan]

This hit a nerve with me as well. This system is so screwed and I feel like by being here and researching I am fighting back.

 

[scarywood75]

This whole experience has really made upset me with the US healthcare system (its not the only thing). Eli saying that compounded meds are bad while overcharging us is insane. The only reason I am moving to researching these chemicals is because of their pricing.

Semaglutide / mo
US: 936
Canada: 147
UK: 93

Why is it ten times more expensive here? Because it can be. I have held for a while now that the US is subsidizing these other countries medical costs because we do not negotiate like other countries. UK wants a lower price? Fine we will up the price in the US. They should not able to charge the US more than any G7 country.

In general a US patient cannot get these drugs through insurance unless they are diabetic. If you're pre-diabetic your're going to have to wait. If your morbidly obese but not diabetic, sorry, eat more sugar.

These drugs should be thought of as preventive care and covered as such.

It's just crazy, I'm in Canada and here it's considered a very expensive medication.

Each time I went to my pharmacy you could see the face of the cashier that said : what the fuck this is so expensive

And also each time I got asked : you don't have insurance for that?! Poor you that's very expensive to pay out of pocket

Reason why? Because most people get out the pharmacies here with like a 5$ receipt

It's not even cheaper because the government pays for it (because they don't as much as I know). US just gets ripped off and fucked hard just because Elli Lilly can

 

[AndyPanda]

It's just crazy, I'm in Canada and here it's considered a very expensive medication.

Each time I went to my pharmacy you could see the face of the cashier that said : what the fuck this is so expensive

And also each time I got asked : you don't have insurance for that?! Poor you that's very expensive to pay out of pocket

Reason why? Because most people get out the pharmacies here with like a 5$ receipt

It's not even cheaper because the government pays for it (because they don't as much as I know). US just gets ripped off and fucked hard just because Elli Lilly can

Because many of our politicians in the United States have ties to these companies. A quick google search might make some people sick if they didn't already know.

 

[noteablequotable]

Because many of our politicians in the United States have ties to these companies. A quick google search might make some people sick if they didn't already know.

I think it's also important to add that there is a strong anti-government sentiment that makes the kind of reforms that have been mentioned in this thread difficult to enact. Some people are very sensitive to anything that could framed as "government overreach".

 

[YoYoFat]

I wonder what his thoughts would be on the prescriber being the pharmacy? (or owning, or a vested interest). Whether for greed or insulation these telehealth companies that do both might be an example Lilly will use to bring down all the good intentions of those who participated in this meeting.

I haven’t found a telehealth provider that is also the pharmacy. They all still use a separate compounding pharmacy (Hallandale, Red Rock, Strive, etc.). But they get not only their “medical visit” fee, but a percentage of the cost of the medication. They take the money from the patients, pay the pharmacy, and keep the rest.

 

[YoYoFat]

This hit a nerve. Lol. I was typing a diatribe but it was becoming political so just stopped. In short, the US subsidizes everything.

You’re welcome, world!

 

[SmokeySquid]

Because many of our politicians in the United States have ties to these companies. A quick google search might make some people sick if they didn't already know.

Profit before all feels like the ultimate answer to any asinine decision that is made up there. Whenever I ask myself who this benefits, it's never me or you. It always feels like scrooge mcduck is in charge of the things that affects us, and not an actual person with a conscience.

 

[mostlydamp]

Profit before all feels like the ultimate answer to any asinine decision that is made up there. Whenever I ask myself who this benefits, it's never me or you. It always feels like scrooge mcduck is in charge of the things that affects us, and not an actual person with a conscience.

Unfortunately a lot of physicians, NPs, and PAs also agree with you and are trying to act within the guidelines of what Scrooge McDuck will allow via insurance while knowing that more should be done. It's pretty messed up. It mainly goes back to insurance and the way our healthcare runs. Anyway my point is that the docs don't like it either a lot of the time.

 

[SmokeySquid]

Unfortunately a lot of physicians, NPs, and PAs also agree with you and are trying to act within the guidelines of what Scrooge McDuck will allow via insurance while knowing that more should be done. It's pretty messed up. It mainly goes back to insurance and the way our healthcare runs. Anyway my point is that the docs don't like it either a lot of the time.

Oh I'm aware as I have a bunch of family that are in the medical field and I do feel for them. Well, at least most of them. I have met, and am unfortunately related, to a few that feel nothing for the people they treat and are purely there to make as much money as possible.

Recently, a friend of mine was explaining authorizations for insurance and how often he will prescribe something, whether it be treatment, medicine, or whatever and send the patient on their way, only to have to start fighting the insurance company about whether the patient actually "needs" that treatment to begin with. When did we start allowing insurance to argue with the doctor about the patients needs? It chaps my butt.

I do try and be positive though. I know and interact with a lot more helpers than exploiters thankfully. We just need to see if we can get Scrooge McDuck out of the picture sometime in our lifetimes

 

[nonyabizznez]

I haven’t found a telehealth provider that is also the pharmacy. They all still use a separate compounding pharmacy (Hallandale, Red Rock, Strive, etc.). But they get not only their “medical visit” fee, but a percentage of the cost of the medication. They take the money from the patients, pay the pharmacy, and keep the rest.

Mochi = Aequita is one that comes to mind

 

[amawgmd]

It's just crazy, I'm in Canada and here it's considered a very expensive medication.

Each time I went to my pharmacy you could see the face of the cashier that said : what the fuck this is so expensive

And also each time I got asked : you don't have insurance for that?! Poor you that's very expensive to pay out of pocket

Reason why? Because most people get out the pharmacies here with like a 5$ receipt

It's not even cheaper because the government pays for it (because they don't as much as I know). US just gets ripped off and fucked hard just because Elli Lilly can

My wife has several medical issues and we have been bankrupted three times by medical bills. Mind you we have always had some of the best insurance you can buy and our household income before medical expenses is well above middle class. We also pay for my parents medications and co-pays because they cannot afford it and would literally be dead if we did not.

Our system is really terrible because congress will not get their partisan asses together and pass something to keep the drug and healthcare companies from killing us.

 

[DevynL90]

My wife has several medical issues and we have been bankrupted three times by medical bills. Mind you we have always had some of the best insurance you can buy and our household income before medical expenses is well above middle class. We also pay for my parents medications and co-pays because they cannot afford it and would literally be dead if we did not.

Our system is really terrible because congress will not get their partisan asses together and pass something to keep the drug and healthcare companies from killing us.

we've got an election less than 3 weeks away. i won't say which side or who you should vote for, but in my opinion the choice is obvious if cost of medicine is a high priority concern of yours.

 

[LogLog]

we've got an election less than 3 weeks away. i won't say which side or who you should vote for, but in my opinion the choice is obvious if cost of medicine is a high priority concern of yours.

Yeah. Ones proven it by getting the cost of insulin lowered to a 35 dollar copay cap.

 

[DevynL90]

Yeah. Ones proven it by getting the cost of insulin lowered to a 35 dollar copay cap.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/14/politics/fact-check-trump-biden-insulin-costs/index.html

 

[amawgmd]

we've got an election less than 3 weeks away. i won't say which side or who you should vote for, but in my opinion the choice is obvious if cost of medicine is a high priority concern of yours.

Neither side will touch this, there is too much pharma money on the table for both. The fix is 'pretty easy' from my armchair but simply wont happen. One side wants the church to handle healthcare (thoughts and prayers baby, thoughts and prayers) and the other thinks the government should own healthcare, we know whats good for you. How about you let me decide but make sure we are paying more as consumers than any other G7 nation? This is probably enough soap-boxing from me.

 

[DevynL90]

Neither side will touch this, there is too much pharma money on the table for both. The fix is 'pretty easy' from my armchair but simply wont happen. One side wants the church to handle healthcare (thoughts and prayers baby, thoughts and prayers) and the other thinks the government should own healthcare, we know whats good for you. How about you let me decide but make sure we are paying more as consumers than any other G7 nation? This is probably enough soap-boxing from me.

i mean idk about you but i think the tens of millions of people on medicare will appreciate the fact that they're finally able to negotiate drug prices which went into place with the inflation reduction act. or how the affordable care act made it possible for folks with pre existing conditions to be able to get healthcare when denied coverage.

there's no comparison between the two. pretending otherwise is being dishonest. that doesn't mean that anyone is perfect. not by a longshot. but one side is significantly better than the other on this issue.

 

[amawgmd]

i mean idk about you but i think tens of millions of people on medicare will appreciate the fact that they're finally able to negotiate drug prices which went into place with the inflation reduction act. or how the affordable care act made it possible for folks with pre existing conditions to be able to get healthcare when denied coverage.

there's no comparison between the two. pretending otherwise is being dishonest. that doesn't mean that anyone is perfect. not by a longshot. but one side is significantly better than the other on this issue.

Yes, the affordable care act is amazing, it very much controlled my healthcare costs. Prior to the ACA I had to change jobs because we maxed out the healthcare plan (Yes that was a thing). So definitely night and day.

I pay my parents copays for medicare so while some things are working ok with medicare in a lot of ways its worse than my private insurance, pretending otherwise is is dishonest. Medicaid is actually a much better healthcare plan than either mine or medicare, however, my parents do not qualify for medicaid (yet).

I harp on drug costs because its the last area that can really ruin a family. When a drug is just not covered you're kind of sol. I got into the research line because we could not afford specific drugs for my wife. Some I was able to afford by buying overseas legally until that was shut down. Some by compounding until that eventually gets shut down (which it will again). Others I have ordered from China or India and tested. Now there are some rumors (could be fear mongers) that they will shut down the labs for testing. These last few happened under blue administrations.

While I agree in principal one side has generally been better for healthcare and it very much changed how I vote, neither side seems willing to take on the drug companies. Sure, they might go after a singular drug price here or there (i.e. insulin or epi-pens) they wont go after the problem as s problem, they are going after political wins with point solutions.

 

[DevynL90]

Yes, the affordable care act is amazing, it very much controlled my healthcare costs. Prior to the ACA I had to change jobs because we maxed out the healthcare plan (Yes that was a thing). So definitely night and day.

I pay my parents copays for medicare so while some things are working ok with medicare in a lot of ways its worse than my private insurance, pretending otherwise is is dishonest. Medicaid is actually a much better healthcare plan than either mine or medicare, however, my parents do not qualify for medicaid (yet).

I harp on drug costs because its the last area that can really ruin a family. When a drug is just not covered you're kind of sol. I got into the research line because we could not afford specific drugs for my wife. Some I was able to afford by buying overseas legally until that was shut down. Some by compounding until that eventually gets shut down (which it will again). Others I have ordered from China or India and tested. Now there are some rumors (could be fear mongers) that they will shut down the labs for testing. These last few happened under blue administrations.

While I agree in principal one side has generally been better for healthcare and it very much changed how I vote, neither side seems willing to take on the drug companies. Sure, they might go after a singular drug price here or there (i.e. insulin or epi-pens) they wont go after the problem as s problem, they are going after political wins with point solutions.

that's a totally fair critique and i don't disagree really with anything that you just said. i've still got quite some time before i make it to medicare myself but as of now i've got an autoimmune disease that costs 25k per injection every 3 months (thank god my insurance is good right now), but the thought of medicare not improving over the next 20-30 years is terrifying to me because i'd never be able to afford that out of pocket.

anyways, it wasn't my intention to go in too hard on this because i know politics is generally a no no, but the door was already ajar with talk of congress so i just felt the need to draw a distinction between the two caucuses on this particular issue.

 

[amawgmd]

that's a totally fair critique and i don't disagree really with anything that you just said. i've still got quite some time before i make it to medicare myself but as of now i've got an autoimmune disease that costs 25k per injection every 3 months (thank god my insurance is good right now), but the thought of medicare not improving over the next 20-30 years is terrifying to me because i'd never be able to afford that out of pocket.

anyways, it wasn't my intention to go in too hard on this because i know politics is generally a no no, but the door was already ajar with talk of congress so i just felt the need to draw a distinction between the two caucuses on this particular issue.

Wow, this sings true to me. My first experience with reconstituting was in the 90s buying a drug for my wifes auto-immune disease. It was about 30k a month and not covered by insurance because we hit the lifetime max. In those days it was usenet to find suppliers and textbooks to figure out how to use it. We did have a local lab that was nice enough to test it for me. I think I spent about 2k and bought a years worth. Over the years it become easier to source and harder to find good suppliers. I lost my link for @dionysus spreadsheets so it was good ground up effort for me.

I tried to stay away from politics because its a bit of a religious thing for people.

 

[DevynL90]

Wow, this sings true to me. My first experience with reconstituting was in the 90s buying a drug for my wifes auto-immune disease. It was about 30k a month and not covered by insurance because we hit the lifetime max. In those days it was usenet to find suppliers and textbooks to figure out how to use it. We did have a local lab that was nice enough to test it for me. I think I spent about 2k and bought a years worth. Over the years it become easier to source and harder to find good suppliers. I lost my link for @dionysus spreadsheets so it was good ground up effort for me.

I tried to stay away from politics because its a bit of a religious thing for people.

jesus, 30k in the 90s is like what, 100k today? that's nuts. and every month? never thought i'd appreciate my own 100k annual cost of medication lol.

if there was an option to go gray for my medication i'd be allllllll over that. sadly that's not much of an option with these new age biologics (at least safely), to my knowledge.