China Based Chemical Companies Indicted for Alleged Fentanyl Manufacturing and Distribution

[noteablequotable]

Yiwujia-Suzhou_Greenway has items in their US warehouse. Once they sell out, they will wind down operations until further notice.

I can't screenshot or quote their specific message in order to remain in compliance with Peppy's rules.

 

[fetefille]

the indictment sort of misrepresents the use of it. protonitazene is a potent opioid all on its own. it's not an ingredient of fentanyl. i think sometimes the drug labs combine it with fentanyl maybe but it's also a bad drug on its own.

i was almost ready to have a little sympathy for sry this morning until i read the indictment again and researched the product. it's been sched 1 for 2 years. they advertise it for sale on their website, there is no recognized medical, industrial, or commercial use of it anywhere in the world. the only reason to produce it and sell it in bulk is for illegal drugs.

it is true that they said they didn't deal in the other substances the undercover agent was trying to nail them on - the actual fentanyl ingredients.

Keywords being temporary vs finalized

 

[Vicki]

Weight loss medicines change lives and save lives. One estimate is that 40,000 lives per year could be saved in the US with these medicines. Fentanyl destroys lives and kills. Big difference. Yeah, I won't buy from a company who knows it is killing people.

opioids are used in hospitals too. The companies are providing raw goods, they don't know who the buyer is. Could be a dr with a private practice for all they know

 

[clevesand]

opioids are used in hospitals too. The companies are providing raw goods, they don't know who the buyer is. Could be a dr with a private practice for all they know

This is a stretch. A doctor or a private practice is not buying schedule 1 drugs on Whatsapp. lol

 

[chmuse]

I'm not going to argue that it's healthy to be skeptical.

My problem lies with faulty logic:
"Everyone" is in on the race to the bottom - Chasing low price as a main metric and discussing how cheap it can get. Which at some point (One i personally believe we passed already) will cause issues with manufacturing quality and consistency

"But the raws are so cheap"...
Yes, they are almost free, so why the price? Well, because of risk and operation costs. Who would want to risk their license by producing this stuff in a high quality lab when they are paid with scraps?

"Pay with bananas, and you will have monkeys doing the job"

At the same time, I highly doubt the amount of fent being produced in approved facilities is not strictly monitored - So i have a hard time believing that is the main source and not a dirty warehouse lab. I doubt the fent users are very picky about purity and sterility testing... So if that assumption (keyword being assumption) is correct, who knows what else those labs are used for.

I do believe that cross contamination is a very small risk here tbh, since it would be very bad for business. But could it happen by accident? - I guess.

And I honestly haven't really dived deep enough into the case to comment on the situation specifically. But it was mentioned that this was about raw materials being repurposed after arriving in the US. So I'm unsure if there is any real risk of cross contamination even if the business names are the same.

Concerning what it says about what kind of business you are dealing with - If that wasn't obvious from the get-go, now it is. So the question then would be, how do you separate between those who really doesn't care at all whether the product is safe or has good quality as long as you believe it - From those who actually deliver a quality product and don't take (too many?) shortcuts?

I would say that price is a good start, though not a guarantee. We pay significantly more than most users on here as a vendor - If that's strictly necessary to get a good product, I can't tell for sure. But it allows us to deal with a manufacturer we know more about.

In any case:
The point I was trying to make in the post you replied to, is that users that have been very comfortable with a bunch of different vendors - Needed something like this case for them to properly understand that these are not corner stores that skimp a bit on taxes and maybe sell some expired products, they are the source behind the drug dealer on the corner (figure of speech).

And now, instead of reconsidering how to evaluate and source - we figure all the vendors do the same stuff... But we will still order when the dust settles, so how helpful is that evaluation? ^^,

"I keep a list of sellers I consider more risky than others based on posts I see here and other places and order based on that. I'm also only a month in, so I obviously have less information than someone who has been doing this a while."

I'd just like to point out I said I'm new and have limited information compared to someone like you, who is much more involved. I never said everyone- I said I'm surprised people are surprised. Which may be due to my lack of experience, and that's something I can acknowledge.

"I know enough to know what I DON'T know."

Apparently I don't, because I spoke without researching further into the claims being made re: when it became scheduled and the methods the DEA used. I took part in a conversation I didn't need to meaning just to say 'wow, everyone is surprised by this even though they're buying from smugglers?' and then kept running my mouth. I plead 'I spoke without much thought during and after a mandated 16 hour shift on no sleep'

I'm sorry, I think I'm just taking it personally that I'm the one you chose to reply to. I don't believe you're wrong, but for me, personally, as an inexperienced end buyer, I choose to be skeptical. Because I know I know jack shit. I'm going back to bed

 

[beefsteak]

Weird how this old news was discovered and suddenly a bunch of operations are coincidentally winding down on the same day.

But QSC just said on meso that they're gonna have crazy deals for November.

 

[Bacchus]

"I keep a list of sellers I consider more risky than others based on posts I see here and other places and order based on that. I'm also only a month in, so I obviously have less information than someone who has been doing this a while."

I'd just like to point out I said I'm new and have limited information compared to someone like you, who is much more involved. I never said everyone- I said I'm surprised people are surprised. Which may be due to my lack of experience, and that's something I can acknowledge.

"I know enough to know what I DON'T know."

Apparently I don't, because I spoke without researching further into the claims being made re: when it became scheduled and the methods the DEA used. I took part in a conversation I didn't need to meaning just to say 'wow, everyone is surprised by this even though they're buying from smugglers?' and then kept running my mouth. I plead 'I spoke without much thought during and after a mandated 16 hour shift on no sleep'

I'm sorry, I think I'm just taking it personally that I'm the one you chose to reply to. I don't believe you're wrong, but for me, personally, as an inexperienced end buyer, I choose to be skeptical. Because I know I know jack shit. I'm going back to bed

Actually, I totally agree with your post - And I chose to reply to it in order to build on the point you made, not to criticize you

 

[chmuse]

Actually, I totally agree with your post - And I chose to reply to it in order to build on the point you made, not to criticize you

See? I'm being unreasonably angry. Good night.

 

[Bacchus]

See? I'm being unreasonably angry. Good night.

I could definitely have been clearer though.

My point was that I agree skepticism is healthy, but that it also has to go hand in hand with rationality - Which you clearly demonstrate by having your own list and taking notes, understanding that you are taking a risk, and admitting that you don't know everything.

Apologies for the misunderstanding

 

[Vicki]

This is a stretch. A doctor or a private practice is not buying schedule 1 drugs on Whatsapp. lol

I'm saying the vendors don't know who's buying what. They can assume anything. They're not inherently the bad guy because people want to cut it and sell to junkies on the street.


Edit: in summary, it's not enough of a reason to make me stop doing business with them lol.

 

[Bacchus]

I'm saying the vendors don't know who's buying what. They can assume anything. They're not inherently the bad guy because people want to cut it and sell to junkies on the street.


Edit: in summary, it's not enough of a reason to make me stop doing business with them lol.

Uhm, not that I'm big on (legal) international import/export.

But for controlled substances and stuff that is strong enough to game over someone with a dust particle (figure of speech). I always assumed that the exporter needed a license, and to verify that the importer also has a license and is allowed to buy it?

 

[clayd]

opioids are used in hospitals too. The companies are providing raw goods, they don't know who the buyer is. Could be a dr with a private practice for all they know

the opioid in the sry indictment is not used in hospitals.

 

[clayd]

Keywords being temporary vs finalized

those aren't key words. in both cases, the chemical is illegal in the US

 

[clayd]

Weird how this old news was discovered and suddenly a bunch of operations are coincidentally winding down on the same day.

But QSC just said on meso that they're gonna have crazy deals for November.

the indictments were under seal until october 24. it's new news.

 

[magnum_dorkus]

Oh hell no. Imagine Tirz getting accidentally laced with something stronger than fent.

Protonitazene is estimated to be around 3 times more potent than fentanyl, though precise comparisons vary because protonitazene's effects are less studied. Fentanyl is already about 50 times stronger than heroin and 100 times stronger than morphine, so even slight differences in potency with substances like protonitazene can significantly raise overdose risks.

Because of this extreme potency, even small doses of protonitazene can lead to fatal respiratory depression, making it exceptionally dangerous when mixed with other substances or used unknowingly.

Dude this stuff is no joke. I work in a prison and we had an inmate smuggle some of this stuff in. It put 10 inmates in the hospital in the space of a weekend from overdoses. One of them was thought to be braindead and they didn't think he'd make it but somehow he made a miraculous recovery. This was his second OD in the jail (yes the drug problem is awful ) and the last time he actually DID die for a minute. Smdh. And if I remember correctly, I don't think this shit responds to narcan either, according to the info sheet that was circulated to staff.

 

[noteablequotable]

This is a stretch. A doctor or a private practice is not buying schedule 1 drugs on Whatsapp. lol

And paying with Bitcoin

 

[noteablequotable]

Weird how this old news was discovered and suddenly a bunch of operations are coincidentally winding down on the same day.

But QSC just said on meso that they're gonna have crazy deals for November.

I don't think this was discovered now. The indictment was probably sealed (hidden from general public and the accused) for a while, and was recently unsealed. I can't confirm right now because I'm at work, but I think this is what happened.

 

[dogmom]

the indictment sort of misrepresents the use of it. protonitazene is a potent opioid all on its own. it's not an ingredient of fentanyl. i think sometimes the drug labs combine it with fentanyl maybe but it's also a bad drug on its own.

i was almost ready to have a little sympathy for sry this morning until i read the indictment again and researched the product. it's been sched 1 for 2 years. they advertise it for sale on their website, there is no recognized medical, industrial, or commercial use of it anywhere in the world. the only reason to produce it and sell it in bulk is for illegal drugs.

it is true that they said they didn't deal in the other substances the undercover agent was trying to nail them on - the actual fentanyl ingredients.

Thanks for clarifying that. It sounds like a scary drug.

 

[HoneyBeez]

I'm fairly confident a mix up like that couldn't happen with a FDA regulated lab/pharmacy

It does happen at retail and facility pharmacies occasionally. Usually caught before it reaches a patient, but not always. Not defending potentially irresponsible manufacturing practices.

 

[stickfigure]

Narcan is available over the counter at most pharmacies in the U.S. It reverses the symptoms of opioid overdose, has a four-year shelf life, and is harmless if administered to a person not under the influence of opioids. It's a good idea to keep one at home if you live in the U.S., much like having a fire extinguisher. You may never use it, but it’s safer to have one just in case.