Cycling or Life-long Use

[pokemonster]

Starting my 4th week on Reta, love the effects. Down 15 lbs already. Now, I’ve been planning on simply cycling the Reta and dropping to a maintenance dose once I hit my goal weight (I’m estimating 6 months), then tapering off completely slowly over time. If I notice benefits I want to keep for life aside from the weight loss, I’ll consider taking it for longer.

People on the Reta Reddit say this approach is simply not possible and that all GLP-1s are required to be life long usage. Anyone saying they don’t want to take it for life is immediately shut down. Here’s an example of the top reply on a post. I understand there may be lifelong benefits aside from weight loss, but not everyone wants to just sign up for taking this for life and anytime the question is posed, this is the answer they give. I’d like this forum’s thoughts as it seems like a much more constructive community than the reddits. Anyone have experience with successfully getting off GLP-1s?

 

[Gamma662keV]

I think the overwhelming consensus, and the patient data shows, that if you stop you'll gain back. However, I also read something about a weight setpoint (it had a better medical description) that once you maintain a certain weight, your body's natural setpoint will slowly adjust to that. Takes years I think.

 

[Int96]

They are indented to be used continuously. You might be able to get off it if you make substantial lifestyle and eating changes but most people will gain weight back and also lose the other benefits. Best to stay on a low maintenance dose.

 

[DwightTheDelight]

Starting my 4th week on Reta, love the effects. Down 15 lbs already. Now, I’ve been planning on simply cycling the Reta and dropping to a maintenance dose once I hit my goal weight (I’m estimating 6 months), then tapering off completely slowly over time. If I notice benefits I want to keep for life aside from the weight loss, I’ll consider taking it for longer.

People on the Reta Reddit say this approach is simply not possible and that all GLP-1s are required to be life long usage. Anyone saying they don’t want to take it for life is immediately shut down. Here’s an example of the top reply on a post. I understand there may be lifelong benefits aside from weight loss, but not everyone wants to just sign up for taking this for life and anytime the question is posed, this is the answer they give. I’d like this forum’s thoughts as it seems like a much more constructive community than the reddits. Anyone have experience with successfully getting off GLP-1s?

View attachment 5375

I will be cycling on and off/having some on hand after slowly coming off these meds. I've been on these shots for a little over a year now and I'm underwhelmed at how they perform at this point of the process.

The magic that helped me lose 70-80 over my first two months and 180 over my first year is gone. Even at 15mg of tirz every 5 days with Cagri added in, I can no longer feel the post shot day suppression that I used to feel. I can't wait to hit my goal weight and enter maintenance. I'm so tired of being in weight loss mode - 30 more lbs to go.

 

[Theotherone55]

This is a real reason why most people need to be really changing their diet and lifestyle ALONG with using the drug. Just taking a drug, eating less, and hoping you can stop wont do a damn thing. Realistically, GLP-1s need to be 1 of many tools in your tool bag for fat loss/maintenance.

Imagine eating McDonalds 3x a day. Taking Tirz or Reta cuts thats to twice...then once.
You cannot just get off and go back to eating McD's 3x aagain. You have to be learning other things and making other changes along the way. It's really that simple.

 

[pokemonster]

They are indented to be used continuously. You might be able to get off it if you make substantial lifestyle and eating changes but most people will gain weight back and also lose the other benefits. Best to stay on a low maintenance dose.

Well shit, if that’s the case, I’m gonna go broke from this. Imagine if we have to go through actual medical providers in the future…

 

[pokemonster]

This is a real reason why most people need to be really changing their diet and lifestyle ALONG with using the drug. Just taking a drug, eating less, and hoping you can stop wont do a damn thing. Realistically, GLP-1s need to be 1 of many tools in your tool bag for fat loss/maintenance.

Imagine eating McDonalds 3x a day. Taking Tirz or Reta cuts thats to twice...then once.
You cannot just get off and go back to eating McD's 3x aagain. You have to be learning other things and making other changes along the way. It's really that simple.

That’s been my goal as well, this Reta giving me the willpower to make the changes needed and slowly adjust back to real life. I’m hoping that works. Sounds like the consensus is don’t come off it.

 

[cldfront]

It's my understanding that the studies showed 80% gained it back if they stopped the meds. That means 20% did not. You might be one of the 20% and I certainly wouldn't just not give it a try. Reddit can be very groupthink oriented. You do you.

 

[hexagonal]

What you do while on these matters.

If you use it to build habits around a healthier relationship with food, get down to a weight where you can exercise regularly, etc., you increase your chances at being able to go off of these and stay off of them. There's a lot of absurd numbers thrown out there about how many calories each pound of muscle will burn, but most people will see a sum total of 8-10 calories burned per day per pound of muscle ( https://www.strongerbyscience.com/calories-muscle-burn/ ). People new to lifting can often put on 15-25lb of muscle mass in their first year, 10-15 the next, etc. That's 250 to 400 more calories a day you can ingest without gaining weight.

The food noise might come back. The cravings. I'm not going to lie and say that these are going to be easy to beat just because you put in good habits and got down to a healthy weight. Not being able to beat them is one of the reasons we got fat in the first place. But if we've made the right changes to our diets, we're not eating nearly as much calorie dense and hyper-palatable food. If we've spent a year or two adding muscle, we can eat more in general.

If you don't exercise and just eat less of the same bad food, then yeah, to keep the weight off, you'll need to keep taking the drug.

And to be clear, I'm not making a moral argument about this. Calorie dense hyper-palatable food tastes great! I fuckin' love it. IF you have decided that you're OK with just using these to ensure you only eat so much of that to keep you weight down, you're an adult, do what you want.

 

[pokemonster]

What you do while on these matters.

If you use it to build habits around a healthier relationship with food, get down to a weight where you can exercise regularly, etc., you increase your chances at being able to go off of these and stay off of them. There's a lot of absurd numbers thrown out there about how many calories each pound of muscle will burn, but most people will see a sum total of 8-10 calories burned per day per pound of muscle ( https://www.strongerbyscience.com/calories-muscle-burn/ ). People new to lifting can often put on 15-25lb of muscle mass in their first year, 10-15 the next, etc. That's 250 to 400 more calories a day you can ingest without gaining weight.

The food noise might come back. The cravings. I'm not going to lie and say that these are going to be easy to beat just because you put in good habits and got down to a healthy weight. Not being able to beat them is one of the reasons we got fat in the first place. But if we've made the right changes to our diets, we're not eating nearly as much calorie dense and hyper-palatable food. If we've spent a year or two adding muscle, we can eat more in general.

If you don't exercise and just eat less of the same bad food, then yeah, to keep the weight off, you'll need to keep taking the drug.

And to be clear, I'm not making a moral argument about this. Calorie dense hyper-palatable food tastes great! I fuckin' love it. IF you have decided that you're OK with just using these to ensure you only eat so much of that to keep you weight down, you're an adult, do what you want.

I'm hoping to get my ass in gear while on this. Build healthier habits, but the food noise has always been a problem for me. As long as it doesn't come back worse after stopping the drug (any idea if this is the case?), I think I should be able to handle it. I certainly expect to gain some weight. I got this way by gaining on average 3 lbs per year after I graduated college, so even if it comes back at the same rate... I'll be doing just fine !

And yes, take-out, doordash, ubereats was essentially my go to night time activity, so I feel you on the loving food thing. At the least, this shit will cut my food budget in half or more, lol.

 

[Batscout]

I think the overwhelming consensus, and the patient data shows, that if you stop you'll gain back. However, I also read something about a weight setpoint (it had a better medical description) that once you maintain a certain weight, your body's natural setpoint will slowly adjust to that. Takes years I think.

I caught a bit of the news the other day where it was reported that a new study showed that GLP-1s can have a positive effect on the gut micro biome for a long period following cessation of GLP-1s. I think a long term improvement in gut bacteria could feasibly have a continued positive effect on energy, appetite, and overall health.

 

[Deleted member 1393]

What dose are people on that they can lose weight and eat whatever they want? I literally have to incorporate fasting to lose weight on this. I got off my fasting and gained 10 pounds while on 7.5 mg Tz. I kinda don't like you all that just lose weight without trying.

 

[hexagonal]

What dose are people on that they can lose weight and eat whatever they want? I literally have to incorporate fasting to lose weight on this. I got off my fasting and gained 10 pounds while on 7.5 mg Tz. I kinda don't like you all that just lose weight without trying.

Depends on how big the appetite suppression/food noise reduction is. A decent amount of people just stop getting hungry on 2.5mg of tirz and just can't eat the level of food that they did before, and instead just eat a third of whatever they get instead of the full meal.

 

[cldfront]

What dose are people on that they can lose weight and eat whatever they want? I literally have to incorporate fasting to lose weight on this. I got off my fasting and gained 10 pounds while on 7.5 mg Tz. I kinda don't like you all that just lose weight without trying.

Yeah, I'd say those are unicorns that are few and far between. I incorporate intermittent fasting too, as well as a dedicated high protein diet and tons of water. It's a slog, but it's a possible slog because of the meds.

 

[Deleted member 1393]

Yeah, I'd say those are unicorns that are few and far between. I incorporate intermittent fasting too, as well as a dedicated high protein diet and tons of water. It's a slog, but it's a possible slog because of the meds.

Yeah the TZ just helps with being able to fast and not want to die from hunger. Unfortunately, now I have to get back from my regimen because I fell off during the holidays.
🤦🏻‍♀️

 

[Deleted member 1393]

Depends on how big the appetite suppression/food noise reduction is. A decent amount of people just stop getting hungry on 2.5mg of tirz and just can't eat the level of food that they did before, and instead just eat a third of whatever they get instead of the full meal.

Lucky bastards. The 2.5 worked for me for a while but I still had to incorporate fasting.

 

[Int96]

What dose are people on that they can lose weight and eat whatever they want? I literally have to incorporate fasting to lose weight on this. I got off my fasting and gained 10 pounds while on 7.5 mg Tz. I kinda don't like you all that just lose weight without trying.

I think that's most likely to happen on Reta because it boosts your metabolism. I basically eat whatever I want but now I want to eat way less than I used to and my body processes it better and faster.

 

[Galora]

This question gets asked a lot in Reddit and I always respond the same thing, with science.
You can absolutely change your eating habits and ensure that you exercise, be constantly at your TDEE equilibrium to not gain weight. But it's extremely hard, because it's not only a lifestyle / habit problem, is a metabolism issue.

Take a look at this study:

https://assets.ctfassets.net/mpejy6umgthp/4KzdMCzXwIcAoJk2sK8l0D/61da33585e923c23ec31ff7bec279914/VV-TZPPT3_OW2024_JASTREBOFF_SURMOUNT1_THREE_YEAR_DV-021720_V4.4.pdf

It's the SURMOUNT-1 3 year extension. They gave tirz during 3 years in different dosages, then at the 3 year mark, they took them all off. In 17 weeks, most of them (I think 83%?) regained an avg of 7% weight (in just 17 weeks!!!!) and the patients reverted many of their cardio metabolic gains (their BP increased, triglycerides and cholesterol up, A1C up, etc.). We have no info on what happened during those 17 weeks. Did they follow their new lifestyle? it was 3 years to get used to it!

What we DO know, is that most "diets" and lifestyle interventions fail, even gastric surgery / bypass has a failure/weight gain rate after several years.

One of the researchers of the SURMOUNT study mentioned in a video that what GLP-1s do (among other things) is to push the "set point" or "defended fat mass" to a lower level. And when you aren't taking them anymore, your body goes haywire and makes you hungry/adapts the metabolism so you REGAIN the weight. Why? Because adipose tissue has a "memory" and remembers the past set point.
You can read more about that here:

Adipose tissue retains an epigenetic memory of obesity after weight loss - Nature

Stable epigenetic changes indicate the existence of an obesogenic memory in mouse adipocytes that primes cells for pathological responses in an obesogenic environment and potentially contributes to the problematic ‘yo-yo’ effect often seen with dieting.

www.nature.com

And what's the set point: https://health.clevelandclinic.org/set-point-theory

Now... if you weren't obese for a long time, or your weight loss was moderate/small (30 lb?) you might have better luck. If you have a history of disorderly eating, were obese for a long time, or had a lot of weight, or have insulin resistance, pre-diabetes, or are a female going through peri or menopause, you may have a harder way to keep the weight off without the meds.

Maybe you can white knuckle through it, or you are one of those few unicorns that can just do all the hard work without trouble, but it won't be nice. You will be hungry AF, and your body will fight against you.

Me? I'm weak, and I've proven over and over that lifestyle changes are not enough. I'm staying on these meds for life. I'll have to find the right dose & spacing so it works for me.

Best of luck!

 

[hexagonal]

FWIW, set point theory is not universally accepted, particularly in how applicable it is to humans. It's quite possible it is true, but it's also possible that it isn't. Lots of things in animal studies carry over to humans, but even more do not.

 

[McFatty]

I have no expertise in the matter at all, but one of my best personality traits is believing everything I read. This just popped up in my Reddit feed:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Retatrutide/s/BHDSAWuYdI

About to take it as gospel truth, until I read something contradictory.

Thank you for finding this. I've heard other "experts" say the same thing.

 

[GimmeABreak]

I have no expertise in the matter at all, but one of my best personality traits is believing everything I read. This just popped up in my Reddit feed:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Retatrutide/s/BHDSAWuYdI

About to take it as gospel truth, until I read something contradictory.

Nice find and thank you for posting it.

I plan to stabilize weight loss, move into maintain mode and then reduce dose/spread dosing schedule slowly, maybe even over years. Hopefully, to get to the point it is no longer needed but will let my jean size dictate dosage. Jeans are loose, need to reduce dose or spread out dosing. Jeans are tight do the reverse. Hopefully, this works and I don't have to slowly increase dose over time to just maintain. In either case, I have plenty of stock in my freezer.

 

[hotdog!]

What dose are people on that they can lose weight and eat whatever they want? I literally have to incorporate fasting to lose weight on this. I got off my fasting and gained 10 pounds while on 7.5 mg Tz. I kinda don't like you all that just lose weight without trying.

I'm willing to bet it's people who have a LOT more weight to lose, like 80-100lbs or more--the same ones who always lose a lot in the beginning of keto diets. I have been like that so far for these first 45 lbs. Now it's slowing down and I have ~40 more to lose. The last 20-30 lbs I know won't go easily.

So most people who just have a goal of 20-30 lbs to lose probably won't have that "eat whatever and lose a lot" experience.

And if they do, they simply experience much stronger appetite suppression than others.

 

[Sunflower]

Well shit, if that’s the case, I’m gonna go broke from this. Imagine if we have to go through actual medical providers in the future…

Really? I’m spending about $15/mo on GLP1s and saving about $600/mo on junk/ binge food I used to waste.

 

[Sunflower]

I caught a bit of the news the other day where it was reported that a new study showed that GLP-1s can have a positive effect on the gut micro biome for a long period following cessation of GLP-1s. I think a long term improvement in gut bacteria could feasibly have a continued positive effect on energy, appetite, and overall health.

Yep, and gut bacteria have an impact on your cravings. If someone changes their eating habits drastically on GLP1s, over time, their microbiome will shift, and potentially inflict different food preferences. I have been on them for 4.5 months now, and the sweet preference is still declining by the week, while my weight is stable and healthy. Before GLP1s, I could eat 90% sweets all day.

 

[hexagonal]

One thing about all of this is even if food noise and cravings come back, if before you were eating hyper-palatable calorie-dense food, and you just swap to eating high protein, high fiber, etc., you'll almost certainly get full faster than you were eating stuff with tons of refined sugar, carbs, and so on.

It's not perfect, and of course plenty of people struggle with weight even with diets that aren't full of the super calorie dense stuff, but some number of people will be able to keep their weight much closer to in range with that change. Being on tirz and then reta has made it much easier for me to eat that sort of food, and I'm hoping that is a habit I can continue once I reach my goal weight.

 

[ktg123]

I'm willing to bet it's people who have a LOT more weight to lose, like 80-100lbs or more--the same ones who always lose a lot in the beginning of keto diets. I have been like that so far for these first 45 lbs. Now it's slowing down and I have ~40 more to lose. The last 20-30 lbs I know won't go easily.

So most people who just have a goal of 20-30 lbs to lose probably won't have that "eat whatever and lose a lot" experience.

And if they do, they simply experience much stronger appetite suppression than others.

I lost 50 lbs in a year just doing keto and fasting although towards the end I was doing more fasting than I probably should have and even did carnivore for a few months. With 10 more pounds to go, I stalled. Then I started gaining, doing nothing different than I had been doing. I could tell my hormones were all jacked up. I gained back 30 of that 50 and decided I needed to do something different. Started Tirz and the first day I could tell that my hormones were back on track. I still eat healthy keto because that's what I've grown to like, but now I'm losing again and it seems pretty easy.

 

[Hawkeye512]

I think the overwhelming consensus, and the patient data shows, that if you stop you'll gain back. However, I also read something about a weight setpoint (it had a better medical description) that once you maintain a certain weight, your body's natural setpoint will slowly adjust to that. Takes years I think.

I have been on one form of these since 2021 and had to go off several times because I couldn't get Wegovy or ZepBound. It was hard to lose consistently when I was always having to start over. When I got cut off by my company's changing coverage last June, I ate the same but gained 2# a month, and after four months of that, I found and tried reta. Now I'm almost back to where I was last June and am losing very slowly, but still losing on a low dose.

These shots do more for me than help with weight loss; they seem to straighten out my many hormonal problems (Hashimoto's). I'm pretty sure once at goal in about 10 more pounds, I will choose to cycle on/off to give my body a break for a few months but then start back up again. It's so cost prohibitive that it's probably the only way I can keep doing it too, by staying on a lower dose.

I feel like if I just stay on it indefinitely, my body is going to get too used to it so I think of it like carb cycling, except it's peptide cycling. I have a SUPER slow metabolism so it seems to last more than 6 days for me. I just went 9 days between because I had sudden nausea and just could not eat, so I waited.