HGH regulation and solution?

[Don]

Hey guys,

As u probably already know, recent regulations have made it much more difficult to ship HGH from China to many countries. There are still a few suppliers offering small amounts, but it’s definitely not like it used to be.

Recently I heard something interesting that I can’t find much information about. From what I understand, the HGH we usually get is the 22 kDa isoform. Apparently, some people claim that manufacturers could get around certain regulations by producing 20 kDa HGH instead.
I’ve even heard people describe it as a kind of “super HGH” with fewer side effects and potentially better effects overall. Personally, I’m a bit skeptical, and I haven’t been able to find much solid information on it.

Does anyone here know more about 20 kDa HGH or the topic in general? I’d be very interested to hear ur opinions, experiences, or any insights u might have

 

[Mr. Blonde]

Hey guys,

As u probably already know, recent regulations have made it much more difficult to ship HGH from China to many countries. There are still a few suppliers offering small amounts, but it’s definitely not like it used to be.

Recently I heard something interesting that I can’t find much information about. From what I understand, the HGH we usually get is the 22 kDa isoform. Apparently, some people claim that manufacturers could get around certain regulations by producing 20 kDa HGH instead.
I’ve even heard people describe it as a kind of “super HGH” with fewer side effects and potentially better effects overall. Personally, I’m a bit skeptical, and I haven’t been able to find much solid information on it.

Does anyone here know more about 20 kDa HGH or the topic in general? I’d be very interested to hear ur opinions, experiences, or any insights u might have

Never heard of this. About to do a deep dive.

 

[Throttle883]

Following!

 

[wildweasel]

Hey guys,

As u probably already know, recent regulations have made it much more difficult to ship HGH from China to many countries. There are still a few suppliers offering small amounts, but it’s definitely not like it used to be.

Recently I heard something interesting that I can’t find much information about. From what I understand, the HGH we usually get is the 22 kDa isoform. Apparently, some people claim that manufacturers could get around certain regulations by producing 20 kDa HGH instead.
I’ve even heard people describe it as a kind of “super HGH” with fewer side effects and potentially better effects overall. Personally, I’m a bit skeptical, and I haven’t been able to find much solid information on it.

Does anyone here know more about 20 kDa HGH or the topic in general? I’d be very interested to hear ur opinions, experiences, or any insights u might have

kDa is a unit of mass.


What you're describing are different naturally occurring growth hormone isoforms. The standard recombinant HGH used medically is the 22 kDa form because that's the predominant biologically active form in humans and the one that's been studied extensively.


The 20 kDa isoform does exist naturally, but it's a minor variant produced by alternative splicing of the GH gene. As far as I'm aware, there isn't convincing human data showing it's a "super HGH," has fewer side effects, or produces better muscle growth, fat loss, recovery, or IGF-1 levels than conventional 22 kDa HGH.

Personally i wouldnt be surprised if its exactly like every other gh frag out there -- pretty much useless.

Most of the claims I've seen seem to be speculation or marketing rather than evidence-based conclusions. If someone has actual human studies comparing 20 kDa and 22 kDa GH head-to-head, I'd be interested in seeing them, but I'm not aware of any data supporting the idea that 20 kDa is a superior replacement for standard HGH.

 

[wildweasel]

Hey guys,

As u probably already know, recent regulations have made it much more difficult to ship HGH from China to many countries. There are still a few suppliers offering small amounts, but it’s definitely not like it used to be.

Recently I heard something interesting that I can’t find much information about. From what I understand, the HGH we usually get is the 22 kDa isoform. Apparently, some people claim that manufacturers could get around certain regulations by producing 20 kDa HGH instead.
I’ve even heard people describe it as a kind of “super HGH” with fewer side effects and potentially better effects overall. Personally, I’m a bit skeptical, and I haven’t been able to find much solid information on it.

Does anyone here know more about 20 kDa HGH or the topic in general? I’d be very interested to hear ur opinions, experiences, or any insights u might have

Also, OP, just dont get your GH from china and the problem is solved. Theres still plenty available from other sources.

 

[copepmuscle]

So do you swap to the 'morlins? Is HGH as good as they say that the peptide alternative aren't really alternatives?

 

[GLiPtest]

So do you swap to the 'morlins? Is HGH as good as they say that the peptide alternative aren't really alternatives?

The only advantage rHGH has over the secretagogues is the ability to inject amounts much larger than a human could possibly produce. This provides some accelerated fat loss and (minor) muscle building benefits, but exceeding the physiologic limits of growth hormone (IGF-1 levels more than 1.3x the upper limit of normal for your age, or a “Z score” of 2), over the long term, as little as 18 months, risks very real, serious, but insidious and notoriously difficult to notice harms.

To make matters worse, the clock doesn’t “reset” when you take a break. It’s cumulative.

Until recently, running high doses continuously was very, very rare because of expense. Now we’re got people who have no idea what their IGF levels are, or that IGF is even a thing, thinking they can just run rHGH forever at whatever dose because they’re “harmless” like other peptides. rHGH isn’t an addictive drug, but because it boosts thyroid function, some people feel good on it, in some way they find difficult to describe, which makes it habit forming.

Unfortunately this reckless use won’t end well. At least bodybuilders are somewhat accepting of the risks of performance enhancing drugs, so discovering they have an enlarged heart or kidney failure isn’t exactly a surprise.

Mary Sue and Billy Bob Peptide will likely be a lot more vocal to the media, to lawmakers, “demanding something be done” when they find out the “5ius” they were taking because that’s what someone told them to take, not knowing that pushed their IGF to 700, and after 2 years each thinking of the other “wow, he/she is sure aging badly, getting ugly in the face, like they hit a brick wall, look at his/her big ass nose”, “I wonder why my ring isn’t fitting any more, I’m not getting fat”, “why are my teeth misaligned?”, “my sleep is terrible and it’s getting harder to breath (from thickened nasal passages narrowing)”, “why is my voice changing? (enlarged tongue)”, discovering they’re pre-diabetic (or full diabetic) when they were fine a year ago, shoe size changing… it goes on and on. It’s estimated 80% of people with acromegally from pituitary tumors causing excess GH secretion are never diagnosed, because the symptoms above happen in slow motion and rarely noticed or they’re attributed to the aging process. Doctors don’t even notice because they’re not trained to look for them.

Meanwhile, secretagogues can bring you to maximum physiological levels of growth hormone production, all the feedback systems stay in place so the body will block GH / IGF levels from getting excessive, and you’ll still benefit from higher, more youthful levels of GH (IE, better body composition, faster healing, skin / nail / hair quality, etc.

Endocrinologists worldwide stopped prescribing rHGH by “IUs” 20 years ago and use IGF-1 levels to determine the correct dose, rechecking it a couple times a year and adjusting as necessary to keep it within the normal range, specifically to prevent this shit. Some might need 4ius, and for others 2iu might be too much, but without checking IGF there’s no way to know if you’re in the danger zone.

 

[copepmuscle]

The only advantage rHGH has over the secretagogues is the ability to inject amounts much larger than a human could possibly produce. This provides some accelerated fat loss and (minor) muscle building benefits, but exceeding the physiologic limits of growth hormone (IGF-1 levels more than 1.3x the upper limit of normal for your age, or a “Z score” of 2), over the long term, as little as 18 months, risks very real, serious, but insidious and notoriously difficult to notice harms.

To make matters worse, the clock doesn’t “reset” when you take a break. It’s cumulative.

Until recently, running high doses continuously was very, very rare because of expense. Now we’re got people who have no idea what their IGF levels are, or that IGF is even a thing, thinking they can just run rHGH forever at whatever dose because they’re “harmless” like other peptides. rHGH isn’t an addictive drug, but because it boosts thyroid function, some people feel good on it, in some way they find difficult to describe, which makes it habit forming.

Unfortunately this reckless use won’t end well. At least bodybuilders are somewhat accepting of the risks of performance enhancing drugs, so discovering they have an enlarged heart or kidney failure isn’t exactly a surprise.

Mary Sue and Billy Bob Peptide will likely be a lot more vocal when they find out the “5ius” they were taking because that’s what someone told them to take, not knowing that pushed their IGF to 700, and after 2 years each thinking of the other “wow, he/she is sure aging badly, getting ugly in the face, like they hit a brick wall, look at his/her big ass nose”, “I wonder why my ring isn’t fitting any more, I’m not getting fat”, “why are my teeth misaligned?”, “my sleep is terrible and it’s getting harder to breath (from thickened nasal passages narrowing)”, “why is my voice changing? (enlarged tongue)”, discovering they’re pre-diabetic (or full diabetic) when they were fine a year ago, shoe size changing… it goes on and on. It’s estimated 80% of people with acromegally from pituitary tumors causing excess GH secretion are never diagnosed, because the symptoms above happen in slow motion and rarely noticed or attributed to aging. Doctors don’t even notice because they’re not trained to look for them.

Meanwhile, secretagogues can bring you to maximum physiological levels of growth hormone production, all the feedback systems stay in place so the body will block GH / IGF levels from getting excessive, and you’ll still benefit from higher, more youthful levels of GH (IE, better body composition, faster healing, skin / nail / hair quality, etc.

I have a fairly similar read re: long term use but gotten the "bro hgh bro". Testamorlin vs sermorelin id go with Testa. Just seeing if my observations are matching with other people.

 

[Don]

kDa is a unit of mass.


What you're describing are different naturally occurring growth hormone isoforms. The standard recombinant HGH used medically is the 22 kDa form because that's the predominant biologically active form in humans and the one that's been studied extensively.


The 20 kDa isoform does exist naturally, but it's a minor variant produced by alternative splicing of the GH gene. As far as I'm aware, there isn't convincing human data showing it's a "super HGH," has fewer side effects, or produces better muscle growth, fat loss, recovery, or IGF-1 levels than conventional 22 kDa HGH.

Personally i wouldnt be surprised if its exactly like every other gh frag out there -- pretty much useless.

Most of the claims I've seen seem to be speculation or marketing rather than evidence-based conclusions. If someone has actual human studies comparing 20 kDa and 22 kDa GH head-to-head, I'd be interested in seeing them, but I'm not aware of any data supporting the idea that 20 kDa is a superior replacement for standard HGH.

So I did my research today.. that's a fair assessment overall, but I also think it's a bit too dismissive.

From what I've been able to find, there actually are a few human studies on 20K-hGH. While there are no large head to head trials against 22K-hGH, the available data suggest that 20K-hGH is biologically active and produces many of the same effects as conventional HGH

In GH-deficient patients, 20K-hGH increased IGF-1 and IGFBP-3 levels, reduced fat mass, and increased lean body mass. The authors of one study concluded that its metabolic effects were broadly comparable to those of 22K-hGH.
What's also interesting is that some data suggest 20K-hGH may be less diabetogenic than 22K-hGH. In animal studies it produced significantly less insulin ressistance, and in the limited human data available, glucose and insulin changes appeared relatively mild compared with what is often seen with standard HGH.
There are also mechanistic studies showing that 20K-hGH has much lower activity at the prolactin receptor while still acting as a full agonist at the GH receptor. Whether that translates into fewer side effects in humans is still unknown, but it's an interesting difference that probably deserves more research.

So I agree that there's currently no evidence that 20K-hGH is some kind of "super HGH" or that it's clearly superior to standard 22K-hGH. However, I also don't think the existing data support the idea that it's "pretty much useless" like many GH fragments. The limited evidence available actually suggests it has many of the same biological and metabolic effects as conventional HGH and lesser side effects

The biggest issue is simply that 22K-hGH has decades of clinical use and long-term data behind it, whereas 20K-hGH has only been studied in relatively small trials. For now, I'd say it's an interesting isoform worth keeping an eye on rather than somethinng that can already be called better or worse than standard HGH

 

[wildweasel]

So I did my research today.. that's a fair assessment overall, but I also think it's a bit too dismissive.

From what I've been able to find, there actually are a few human studies on 20K-hGH. While there are no large head to head trials against 22K-hGH, the available data suggest that 20K-hGH is biologically active and produces many of the same effects as conventional HGH

In GH-deficient patients, 20K-hGH increased IGF-1 and IGFBP-3 levels, reduced fat mass, and increased lean body mass. The authors of one study concluded that its metabolic effects were broadly comparable to those of 22K-hGH.
What's also interesting is that some data suggest 20K-hGH may be less diabetogenic than 22K-hGH. In animal studies it produced significantly less insulin ressistance, and in the limited human data available, glucose and insulin changes appeared relatively mild compared with what is often seen with standard HGH.
There are also mechanistic studies showing that 20K-hGH has much lower activity at the prolactin receptor while still acting as a full agonist at the GH receptor. Whether that translates into fewer side effects in humans is still unknown, but it's an interesting difference that probably deserves more research.

So I agree that there's currently no evidence that 20K-hGH is some kind of "super HGH" or that it's clearly superior to standard 22K-hGH. However, I also don't think the existing data support the idea that it's "pretty much useless" like many GH fragments. The limited evidence available actually suggests it has many of the same biological and metabolic effects as conventional HGH and lesser side effects

The biggest issue is simply that 22K-hGH has decades of clinical use and long-term data behind it, whereas 20K-hGH has only been studied in relatively small trials. For now, I'd say it's an interesting isoform worth keeping an eye on rather than somethinng that can already be called better or worse than standard HGH

Yeah, you changed my mind. I think that’s fair. Maybe I was too quick to draw a conclusion.

Honestly, if they can skirt regulations by doing this, I would more than likely be giving it a shot myself so I can make a better opinion

 

[GLiPtest]

I have a fairly similar read re: long term use but gotten the "bro hgh bro". Testamorlin vs sermorelin id go with Testa. Just seeing if my observations are matching with other people.

Yeah I hear it too. There’s a difference in the sacrifices (to their health and longevity) competitive bodybuilders are willing to make for the sport, knowing the risks (including accepting there are risks they don’t know), which typically involves high doses for short cycles (6 months or less), and non-pros blindly using rHGH with no regard for safety, year round, thinking it’s the fountain of youth, without taking the basic precautions of monitoring IGF or morning fasted glucose, both critical for safety.

There is NOTHING positive to gain with supraphysiologic dosing over the long term. High-normal levels is the max benefit you can get, where you don’t tip the rate of cell division from “heal like a 22 year old” into “bone growth rate of a 12 year old, except it has no where to go so bone just thickens in abnormal places”, or stimulate those homeostatic cancer cells we all carry, from “immune system successfully keeping it from growing so it never becomes an issue” to “Huh, turns out those headaches are from a one in a million chance type of inoperable glioblastoma in my brain. What terrible luck”.

Every time you read a recommendation to “just use x IUs” or worse, the old “as much as you can afford” advice, with no mention of IGF or glucose levels, just replace that with “I’m an unaccountable asshole who doesn’t give a shit about your wellbeing any more than my own, but at least I’ll feel better if others do the same stupid things I do.”

 

[rkbleddyn]

I must be a big coward because I desperately have to get rid of my visceral fat before it kills me. And Tirzepatide is basically not touching it. The Tirz is eliminating subQ fat on my belly and love handles, but it is not touching that visceral fat. I guess it will go after what remains of my muscle before it does that.

I'm going to try Ipamorelin and MOTS c after I finish my cycle of SS-31. I'm even scared of adding CJC to it and even more scared of Tesamorelin. Forget about HGH, no way.

I'm testing my IGF1 on Tuesday morning along with a full metabolic and hormone panel before I start the Ipa. If nothing looks funky with my blood counts, I will probably go back on low does TRT or maybe Enclomiphene as well.

Oh yeah, exercise, I keep forgetting that one, because hard.

 

[wildweasel]

I must be a big coward because I desperately have to get rid of my visceral fat before it kills me. And Tirzepatide is basically not touching it. The Tirz is eliminating subQ fat on my belly and love handles, but it is not touching that visceral fat. I guess it will go after what remains of my muscle before it does that.

I'm going to try Ipamorelin and MOTS c after I finish my cycle of SS-31. I'm even scared of adding CJC to it and even more scared of Tesamorelin. Forget about HGH, no way.

I'm testing my IGF1 on Tuesday morning along with a full metabolic and hormone panel before I start the Ipa. If nothing looks funky with my blood counts, I will probably go back on low does TRT or maybe Enclomiphene as well.

Oh yeah, exercise, I keep forgetting that one, because hard.

How do you know it’s not touching visceral? Do you get dexa scans or something?

TBH if you are truly not losing visceral fat during otherwise significant weight loss period it likely points to other factors in your diet, maybe alcohol intake, but I’d be more curious to know why you think it isn’t affecting your visceral fat

 

[Don]

I must be a big coward because I desperately have to get rid of my visceral fat before it kills me. And Tirzepatide is basically not touching it. The Tirz is eliminating subQ fat on my belly and love handles, but it is not touching that visceral fat. I guess it will go after what remains of my muscle before it does that.

I'm going to try Ipamorelin and MOTS c after I finish my cycle of SS-31. I'm even scared of adding CJC to it and even more scared of Tesamorelin. Forget about HGH, no way.

I'm testing my IGF1 on Tuesday morning along with a full metabolic and hormone panel before I start the Ipa. If nothing looks funky with my blood counts, I will probably go back on low does TRT or maybe Enclomiphene as well.

Oh yeah, exercise, I keep forgetting that one, because hard.

Tirz as a peptide does not touch fat at all. It works as a hunger supressor and the resulting diet (best-case scenario) is what makes you lose fat.
Since visceral fat is more metabolically active than subcutaneous fat, it tends to come off relatively quickly during a diet, often faster than subcutaneous fat. So I'm not sure why you think Tirzepatide wouldn't reduce visceral fat.

Unless you have some underlying condition that's making visceral fat particularly stubborn, I don't see much reason to use tesamorelin just for that

 

[copepmuscle]

I'm going to try Ipamorelin and MOTS c after I finish my cycle of SS-31. I'm even scared of adding CJC to it and even more scared of Tesamorelin. Forget about HGH, no way.
....
Oh yeah, exercise, I keep forgetting that one, because hard.

Okay I'll bite... Why are those two a bridge too far.

Yep exercise is still required

 

[birdwhacker]

I must be a big coward because I desperately have to get rid of my visceral fat before it kills me.

Ludicrous talk. If you truly do want to run tesa, understand that you need to be on it consistently for minimum 6-8 months for it to help you move the fat around. 6 months being the minimum.

In my experience, people like you who're captivated with buzzwords like visceral fat aren't really able to play the long game like this. You'd be better off...

Oh yeah, exercise, I keep forgetting that one, because hard.

Exercising. Maybe don't forget that one. That's what's going to lost your fat, the visceral fat too, and make you healthier so your muscles aren't made out of shit. Every single person that you look up to, actors, singers, influencers, who look good and you say "I want to look like them," are all working out.

How do you know it’s not touching visceral? Do you get dexa scans or something?

Most dexa scans aren't even accurate. Crazy that people think that their home scales can tell them their visceral fat amounts. Visceral fat is supposed to account for 10-20% of your total body weight. Only way you'll measure it is with a good dexa or an MRI.

Unless you have some underlying condition that's making visceral fat particularly stubborn, I don't see much reason to use tesamorelin just for that

But some influencer told me that visceral fat is all the rage and I have to do everything in my power to get rid of it!

Okay I'll bite... Why are those two a bridge too far.

You do need to run labs with HGH and maybe invest in a glucose monitor. Really though I think it's overblown with most people here only interested in running 1.5 or 2iu.

 

[CNCCurrency]

Okay I'll bite... Why are those two a bridge too far.

Yep exercise is still required

Me too. interested in the bridge that is?

 

[copepmuscle]

You do need to run labs with HGH and maybe invest in a glucose monitor. Really though I think it's overblown with most people here only interested in running 1.5 or 2iu.

I was referring to this statement:

"I'm even scared of adding CJC to it and even more scared of Tesamorelin"

 

[quicksilver80]

Wont suprise me india will take up the slack.

 

[rkbleddyn]

Ludicrous talk. If you truly do want to run tesa, understand that you need to be on it consistently for minimum 6-8 months for it to help you move the fat around. 6 months being the minimum.

In my experience, people like you who're captivated with buzzwords like visceral fat aren't really able to play the long game like this. You'd be better off...


Exercising. Maybe don't forget that one. That's what's going to lost your fat, the visceral fat too, and make you healthier so your muscles aren't made out of shit. Every single person that you look up to, actors, singers, influencers, who look good and you say "I want to look like them," are all working out.


Most dexa scans aren't even accurate. Crazy that people think that their home scales can tell them their visceral fat amounts. Visceral fat is supposed to account for 10-20% of your total body weight. Only way you'll measure it is with a good dexa or an MRI.


But some influencer told me that visceral fat is all the rage and I have to do everything in my power to get rid of it!


You do need to run labs with HGH and maybe invest in a glucose monitor. Really though I think it's overblown with most people here only interested in running 1.5 or 2iu.

No sure why you are assuming I cannot stick with something for 6 months. You really don't have any idea of the things I've endured for long periods of time. I wasn't expecting to do any 'morelin' class drugs or anything else to magically make years of accumulated visceral fat disappear and I think you are taking way too lightly just how deadly having fat in all your organs is. Maybe OK for you, but is the root cause of millions of men going to an early grave.

 

[birdwhacker]

I was referring to this statement:

"I'm even scared of adding CJC to it and even more scared of Tesamorelin"

Wow, looney. CJC can cause some sides but tesa is as gentle as they come.

 

[birdwhacker]

I think you are taking way to lightly just how deadly having fat in all your organs is. Maybe OK for you, but is the root cause of millions of men going to an early grave.

Buddy, just lose weight. Exercise and track your calories. Visceral fat is the first to go. Unless you're a heavy drinker or have a condition you don't need to worry about visceral fat specifically.

What's the name of the influencer that made you so scared of visceral fat?

 

[rkbleddyn]

Wow, looney. CJC can cause some sides but tesa is as gentle as they come.

I'm not you and you are not me, eveyone is different. I actually discussed this with my Dr. For me, the reason I would avoid Tesa is that it is more prone to cause water retention, and every time I get fat like this, I get edema and I don't want any of that. So I'm starting with Ipa. Yeah, Tesa is probably going to target the visceral fat more quickly, but maybe not a good solution for me.

 

[CNCCurrency]

No sure why you are assuming I cannot stick with something for 6 months. You really don't have any idea of the things I've endured for long periods of time. I wasn't expecting to do any 'morelin' class drugs or anything else to magically make years of accumulated visceral fat disappear and I think you are taking way too lightly just how deadly having fat in all your organs is. Maybe OK for you, but is the root cause of millions of men going to an early grave.

You really need to to some research, short sighted comes to mind!

 

[birdwhacker]

I'm not you and you are not me, eveyone is different. I actually discussed this with my Dr. For me, the reason I would avoid Tesa is that it is more prone to cause water retention, and every time I get fat like this, I get edema and I don't want any of that. So I'm starting with Ipa. Yeah, Tesa is probably going to target the visceral fat more quickly, but maybe not a good solution for me.

Tesa won't target visceral fat any more than GH or ipa will. It's merely had studies done specifically on that as a prelude to being marketed to HIV patients.

Water weight is just what happens when you increase growth hormone. If you're worried about it, simply start slow. If you truly have a need to "target visceral fat" then using both is the most effective way to go about that.

But you likely don't have more visceral fat than the average person at your weight and age. You need to do cardio and manage your caloric intake so that the GLP can do its job.

Any GLP drug will be dozens of times more effective than tesa/ipa for reducing visceral fat by virtue of making you lose weight.

 

[copepmuscle]

I'm not you and you are not me, eveyone is different. I actually discussed this with my Dr. For me, the reason I would avoid Tesa is that it is more prone to cause water retention, and every time I get fat like this, I get edema and I don't want any of that. So I'm starting with Ipa. Yeah, Tesa is probably going to target the visceral fat more quickly, but maybe not a good solution for me.

Not an attack genuine question. Interesting regarding water retention but isn't that also a concern with ipamoreline? What has your doctor said about the sourcing? Mine gave me leeway for a compounding pharmacy but was against any grey market participation. Still orders blood work for me but encourages me discontinue any other sources besides the compound pharmacy.

 

[rkbleddyn]

Buddy, just lose weight. Exercise and track your calories. Visceral fat is the first to go. Unless you're a heavy drinker or have a condition you don't need to worry about visceral fat specifically.

What's the name of the influencer that made you so scared of visceral fat?

I don't drink and I don't have some condition. For me, when I gain weight, I gain it in the abdominal region primarily. Glad to know you have the solution for me though, I guess I can stop researching and discussing with my GP.

 

[birdwhacker]

I don't drink and I don't have some condition. For me, when I gain weight, I gain it in the abdominal region primarily.

Just like everyone else. Abdominal fat is not visceral fat. Funny how you dodge every question that matters.

Glad to know you have the solution for me though, I guess I can stop researching and discussing with my GP.

I do know the solution for you. It's the same solution for everyone, barring those with extreme conditions that change the nature of things.

You said you don't have any crazy conditions, so you're on the same playing field as everyone else here. You need to learn to play ball before that mindset keeps you fat. Count your calories and do cardio and the "visceral fat" will slide right off.

 

[rkbleddyn]

Not an attack genuine question. Interesting regarding water retention but isn't that also a concern with ipamoreline? What has your doctor said about the sourcing? Mine gave me leeway for a compounding pharmacy but was against any grey market participation. Still orders blood work for me but encourages me discontinue any other sources besides the compound pharmacy.

It is, but from what I can gather, not as much. If it does cause that, I can just stop it. I do my blood work and work with my GP. He shares sources with me and gets anything compounded that can be, like my Tirz. Ipa cannot be compounded of course, and he cannot prescribe Tesa since I don't have a specific condition for that. So we discuss this stuff, but he doesn't recommend it to me. Their practice is more of functional medicine and they are open to things outside the mainstream, but of course still stay inside of legal boundaries that could get them into trouble.

 

[rkbleddyn]

Just like everyone else. Abdominal fat is not visceral fat. Funny how you dodge every question that matters.


I do know the solution for you. It's the same solution for everyone, barring those with extreme conditions that change the nature of things.

You said you don't have any crazy conditions, so you're on the same playing field as everyone else here. You need to learn to play ball before that mindset keeps you fat. Count your calories and do cardio and the "visceral fat" will slide right off.

But it IS mostly visceral fat, I did a freaking MRI. Geez. Do you just like to argue with people and call them silly names? 🙄