JEEP JEEP Important Announcement

"Due to raw material limitations, the endotoxin indicators of domestic generic products in China cannot meet the standards or be comparable to those of Lilly products.
In addition, as stated in our official announcements and promotions sales etc, we only guarantee the purity and filling content of our products. "

Absolutely a horrible response, any one buying from the already over priced JEEP is IMHO just stupid. BTW purity would mean pure without contamination or endotoxins.
 
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Judging by the Uther fiasco last month, I'm curious if jeep will continue as usual. I certainly didn't notice any serious repercussions for Uther
 
Habibibi said:
Judging by the Uther fiasco last month, I'm curious if jeep will continue as usual. I certainly didn't notice any serious repercussions for Uther
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Probably because he finally went with the more expensive NAD starter materials. His new batch will be using them. It might have taken some convincing by his customers, but he took action to remedy the situation. Smart man.
 
I may be off base on this as I've only been in the market for a few years but I remember when Peter from "x' struggled to meet M/P. When the product tested poorly , Peter took the time to listen and do something about it as he was smart enough to realize all the potential $$'s. With the recent push to test endo's, I can only hope that the smarter resellers will test endo's before selling even if the price is a bit higher.
 
FartfulCodger said:
I don't get the whole "there was never a guarantee" argument. It seems to me there is an implicit one. When I buy Coca Cola, I'm expecting the unpoisoned version of it.
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You aren't buying coca cola using crypto from drug dealers on the other side of the planet who make their sales people appear as random chinese female avatars. Not every drug deal goes according to plan. You win some you lose some.
 
anhydrous said:
You aren't buying coca cola using crypto from drug dealers on the other side of the planet who make their sales people appear as random chinese female avatars. Not every drug deal goes according to plan. You win some you lose some.
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My expectation's going to stay the same regardless of currency or country.
 
anhydrous said:
You aren't buying coca cola using crypto from drug dealers on the other side of the planet who make their sales people appear as random chinese female avatars. Not every drug deal goes according to plan. You win some you lose some.
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You lose all if you accept 20 times the acceptable endos...cuz now you invited 50. Good job high rolla.
 
FartfulCodger said:
My expectation's going to stay the same regardless of currency or country.
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Reality is right in front of you if you care to see it. If you engage in enough deals eventually you will get burned. You have no meaningful recourse and your expectations should reflect that but maintaining delusional expectations is easier if you prefer the path of least resistance.
 
anhydrous said:
Reality is right in front of you if you care to see it. If you engage in enough deals eventually you will get burned. You have no meaningful recourse and your expectations should reflect that but maintaining delusional expectations is easier if you prefer the path of least resistance.
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The recourse is that many of us will no longer shop there. They need to be made to understand that for their own benefit; it's lesson in how to run a business serving Western customers. Bending over and accepting adversity isn't something Americans typically do.
 
FartfulCodger said:
The recourse is that many of us will no longer shop there. They need to be made to understand that for their own benefit; it's lesson in how to run a business serving Western customers. Bending over and accepting adversity isn't something Americans typically do.
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You're applying our values, our culture, our beliefs, our way of thinking, and our systems to a group of people who have next to nothing in common with us.

A boycott seems an obvious conclusion but don't you think that it is a specious and futile solution? What is to keep them from turning the sign around? Today they are JEEP and Molly. Tomorrow they could just as easily be FORD and Lizzy. Their customers would be none the wiser that they're buying from the same exact sales person, working for the same exact dealer, selling the exact same product, from the exact same assembly line, from the exact same factory. You will win some and you will lose some. Losing hurts 10x more than winning feels good, it is human nature.
 
anhydrous said:
You're applying our values, our culture, our beliefs, our way of thinking, and our systems to a group of people who have next to nothing in common with us.

A boycott seems an obvious conclusion but don't you think that it is a specious and futile solution? What is to keep them from turning the sign around? Today they are JEEP and Molly. Tomorrow they could just as easily be FORD and Lizzy. Their customers would be none the wiser that they're buying from the same exact sales person, working for the same exact dealer, selling the exact same product, from the exact same assembly line, from the exact same factory. You will win some and you will lose some. Losing hurts 10x more than winning feels good, it is human nature.
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FORD and Lizzy will end up selling better stuff, and so will the other sellers, if they saw JEEP and Molly’s business sinking. Basic market dynamics… assuming they’re not terminally oblivious. Lol
 
I completely agree with the general sentiment in the community that JEEP’s response to this situation comes across as harsh. I also agree that we should always keep in mind the inherent risks of going down the grey-market route, and not expect it to be risk-free.

What I’m interested in is exploring alternatives that the community, as well as individual members, can put in place.

Endotoxin testing is certainly part of the answer, with the obvious caveat that we can’t test everything or every batch, and that results could potentially be falsified.

But what about strategies to mitigate the potential effects of contaminated vials on our individual end? This is, of course, in addition to the absolute necessity of using proper reconstitution water or BAC (still find 'amusing' that some people use 'amazon/vendor grade BAC.. 🤯 ) .

Are there any practical ideas or best practices people are following? Eg, I filter each reconstitution, but this does not seem to be enough?
 
I understand the point being made that this is the grey market and these are essentially street drug dealers, and more than likely they will just come back under a different name and peddle the same low quality products they were previously, but they would need to start all over again and build a reputation under their new name. That takes time and they wouldn't be able to charge the ridiculous prices they are currently asking. There will always be a percentage of customers who have a very high risk tolerance and are willing to inject themselves with cheap untested peps from new and unvetted vendors, so they will always have a customer base to start, but in the end they still didn't solve the underlying problem. As they gain popularity again, the whole cycle starts over: more buyers = more testing = more failed tests = reputations ruined again. I've only been in the grey market for about 8 months, so I'm sure this is probably the normal cycle of things, but if they were in this for the long haul they would have just take the issue seriously and said "okay, we are taking this seriously and addressing the manufacturing problems". People would have then heavily tested for a while, good results would start appearing again and they could have saved their reputation.
Also, I'm sure that the grey community is not naive enough to think that this bad batch is isolated to JEEP as they all source from a very few suppliers. I'm sure that other vendors are now going to be put under a microscope and the testing for endos will increase exponentially. If the pressure on the manufacturer will obviously not come from JEEP, I would hope that it comes from other vendors using the same source. At this point, I will be very surprised if JEEP can rise from the ashes due to the negative publicity about their callous response.
 
littledragon25 said:
For what it's worth, Molly has reached out today asking for my advice on what I think Jeep could do moving forward. That shows they want to get it right even if they haven't so far.

Molly and Kelly are the real assets at Jeep. I hope their boss listens to them.
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That's wonderful! I'm happy to hear they are making an effort.
 
New2ton said:
I understand the point being made that this is the grey market and these are essentially street drug dealers, and more than likely they will just come back under a different name and peddle the same low quality products they were previously, but they would need to start all over again and build a reputation under their new name. That takes time and they wouldn't be able to charge the ridiculous prices they are currently asking. There will always be a percentage of customers who have a very high risk tolerance and are willing to inject themselves with cheap untested peps from new and unvetted vendors, so they will always have a customer base to start, but in the end they still didn't solve the underlying problem. As they gain popularity again, the whole cycle starts over: more buyers = more testing = more failed tests = reputations ruined again. I've only been in the grey market for about 8 months, so I'm sure this is probably the normal cycle of things, but if they were in this for the long haul they would have just take the issue seriously and said "okay, we are taking this seriously and addressing the manufacturing problems". People would have then heavily tested for a while, good results would start appearing again and they could have saved their reputation.
Also, I'm sure that the grey community is not naive enough to think that this bad batch is isolated to JEEP as they all source from a very few suppliers. I'm sure that other vendors are now going to be put under a microscope and the testing for endos will increase exponentially. If the pressure on the manufacturer will obviously not come from JEEP, I would hope that it comes from other vendors using the same source. At this point, I will be very surprised if JEEP can rise from the ashes due to the negative publicity about their callous response.
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Word for word: exactly this.
 
cat_walk said:
I completely agree with the general sentiment in the community that JEEP’s response to this situation comes across as harsh. I also agree that we should always keep in mind the inherent risks of going down the grey-market route, and not expect it to be risk-free.

What I’m interested in is exploring alternatives that the community, as well as individual members, can put in place.

Endotoxin testing is certainly part of the answer, with the obvious caveat that we can’t test everything or every batch, and that results could potentially be falsified.

But what about strategies to mitigate the potential effects of contaminated vials on our individual end? This is, of course, in addition to the absolute necessity of using proper reconstitution water or BAC (still find 'amusing' that some people use 'amazon/vendor grade BAC.. 🤯 ) .

Are there any practical ideas or best practices people are following? Eg, I filter each reconstitution, but this does not seem to be enough?
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Filtering each reconstitution helps with bacteria and particles, but it doesn’t remove endotoxins.
 
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anhydrous said:
You're applying our values, our culture, our beliefs, our way of thinking, and our systems to a group of people who have next to nothing in common with us.

A boycott seems an obvious conclusion but don't you think that it is a specious and futile solution? What is to keep them from turning the sign around? Today they are JEEP and Molly. Tomorrow they could just as easily be FORD and Lizzy. Their customers would be none the wiser that they're buying from the same exact sales person, working for the same exact dealer, selling the exact same product, from the exact same assembly line, from the exact same factory. You will win some and you will lose some. Losing hurts 10x more than winning feels good, it is human nature.
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Good point. Takes a few hours to rebrand. Reality is in 2 months well have 600 new people that wont know and wont care cuz their shit was fine.
Like Meso when tracy of qsc or any other vendor randomly burns people, youll have 3 new members say: i got my shit so hes good by me. 5 or 8 years ago theyd band together and say youre done here till you make those 2 guys whole.... However 1 big mouth turns into 50 saying fuck JEEP whenever someone posts "New here. Anyone use Jeep before?"
 
littledragon25 said:
For what it's worth, Molly has reached out today asking for my advice on what I think Jeep could do moving forward. That shows they want to get it right even if they haven't so far.

Molly and Kelly are the real assets at Jeep. I hope their boss listens to them.
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Pretty simple Dragon, run an endo test along with every m/p test... an extra 120 for them and suddenly Jeeps a heavyweight contender again.....
 
This all reminds me of an interesting story from 2008.

The Sanlu Dairy company in China was secretly adding melamine to their milk products. They did this so that it would appear to have a higher protein content and thereby pass QA inspections.

300,000 kids got sick with kidney issues from consuming the milk. Tens of thousands were hospitalized, a few died.

When the fraud was discovered and prosecuted, the ringleaders faced the firing squad. Others, including government officials who were involved, were sentenced to life in prison.
 
Airborne Daddy said:
Good point. Takes a few hours to rebrand. Reality is in 2 months well have 600 new people that wont know and wont care cuz their shit was fine.
Like Meso when tracy of qsc or any other vendor randomly burns people, youll have 3 new members say: i got my shit so hes good by me. 5 or 8 years ago theyd band together and say youre done here till you make those 2 guys whole.... However 1 big mouth turns into 50 saying fuck JEEP whenever someone posts "New here. Anyone use Jeep before?"
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I see your point, and I agree, the way the community reacts now is definitely different from how it used to be, and you’re right to highlight that.
At the same time, perhaps it’s also a matter of age and of a different way of approaching things and experiencing the community.
 
FartfulCodger said:
This all reminds me of an interesting story from 2008.

The Sanlu Dairy company in China was secretly adding melamine to their milk products. They did this so that it would appear to have a higher protein content and thereby pass QA inspections.

300,000 kids got sick with kidney issues from consuming the milk. Tens of thousands were hospitalized, a few died.

When the fraud was discovered and prosecuted, the ringleaders faced the firing squad. Others, including government officials who were involved, were sentenced to life in prison.
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i remember that.
 
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