astroman
GLP-1 Novice
I can’t figure out why significant overfill is a good thing. Wouldn’t that completely throw off the conversion/dosage?
Overfill — a good or bad thing?
- Thread starter astroman
- Start date
It’s good if you know, bad if you don’t. Testing is important.
astroman
GLP-1 Novice
Sure, if you want to pay $300 to get it tested
geoguy78
GLP-1 Specialist
I struggle with the dilemma of spending $2-300 and an entire vial to test a single kit. Maybe I'm just a cheapskate. Ok, no maybe about it - I'm a cheapskate 🤣
There are a couple of ways to navigate this. You can buy several kits at once from the same vendor which will bring down the testing cost per vial to a reasonable level. You can try to buy your kits at the same time as some friends and then all pitch in to get a vial tested, assuming you all got the same batch. You can join a testing group and try to participate in a test that lines up with your purchase.
dionysos
GLP-1 Specialist
You should be, and likely are, buying peptide products that have closely-tied credible COAs. The Analysis contains the actual peptide weight in milligrams to two decimal places.
Always reconstitute using that accurate COA number rather than the 'nominal' label weight the product is sold under. That way you are guaranteed to get accurate injection dosages.
geoguy78
GLP-1 Specialist
I think in the future I'm only going to participate in real group buys, ones coordinated by the purchasers. Not a "group buy" like what Tracy puts on. Nobody wants to donate a vial for testing in these QSC GBs because there's no reimbursement for the lost vial
astroman
GLP-1 Novice
Thank you, sir. My order of Amo T20 arrives tomorrow. From what I’ve read, they seem dependable and have reliable COA’s. Any further info I should know?
scarywood75
Scarlett Johansson
How do you do that? How do you know that a particular vial you tested will contain the same amount of all other vials in the kit? You don't.
To me it seems useless to test for that, maybe to identify a trend with a specific vendor, like if they tend to overfill, etc.
There's no way to know exactly how much you're injecting and I think it's fine.
octoroach
GLP-1 Novice
even if you test, and it comes back overfilled, you have no clue if the next vial is over or under, you just have to accept it may be a bit over or a bit under
Not a bad strategy, just take care to vet the group. Some are pretty risky because you’re putting your trust in the coordinator who is in a position to steal the money, peptides, or both, and in many cases doesn’t have any leverage with the supplier to resolve quality issues that come to light after delivery.
Some are fine, just make sure to get a feel for their reputation outside of their respective telegram/discord servers which can sometimes feel like culty echo chambers because they ban anyone who isn’t 100% unquestioning. And as you see on any peptide discussion platform sometimes people are so grateful to have found a cheaper source for their meds that they become frothy for the leader who introduced them to it, losing sight of what else is out there.
You @geoguy78 may already know all this so apologies if I’m preaching to the choir.
scarywood75
Scarlett Johansson
That makes me think, are there any buy group with coordinator in Canada?
raw_oyster_eater
lemon bottle brewer
I think it's entirely too much money for the testing done. I think the labs are taking advantage of the popularity of peptides just as much as the US suppliers charging 10x the price.
geoguy78
GLP-1 Specialist
Just my take, but I would reconstitute based on the nominal volume and not the CoA volume. Reason being that random batch tests have shown peptide volume being all over the place. The recent Amo group test for example, there were a wide variety of peptide volumes noted. Some over, some under. Now Amo seems to keep their "shot group" pretty tight with their fill amounts, but not all vendors have that kind of fill consistency.
astroman
GLP-1 Novice
From my research, we’re talking about nominal overfill, but some reps are exclaiming 20% overfill like it’s a good thing. A minor 5-10% isn’t gonna knock me over.
geoguy78
GLP-1 Specialist
It's sketchy out there 🤔
If I'm buying from a place with a verified COA attached to the batch I'm purchasing from (and yes, that is a risk that my vial comes from that batch) and if it shows several tested vials at different mgs, I average them and choose that mg number. I'd rather assume the overfill and be cautious in the dosing.
I'm in the process of "onboarding" into a testing server and peptide group buy group to do just that, and I've learned a lot, BUT I've hit the crypto section, all their payments are via crypto, and I just don't know... am I really going to be buying SO MUCH I need to get a crypto wallet and learn all of that too?
dionysos
GLP-1 Specialist
You will very likely have a satisfying experience with your AmoPure purchase; many members have shared their positive experiences. You know from my posts that I have purchased Retatrutide from Amo a couple of times - I'm completely satisfied with it and with them.
Are you guaranteed to have a perfect transaction? No.
They are a company staffed by humans which means imperfection.
They do have the reputation here of responsibly cleaning-up their errors, and that is very significant.
Agreed - the two businesses to go into: scaffolding and peptide testing labs.
geoguy78
GLP-1 Specialist
Personally I'm starting to think that the value of third party testing is overrated. All it does is verify that what you bought is what you think it is, how pure the peptide is, and how much peptide a vial contains. What it doesn't tell you are the things people really want to know from a harm reduction standpoint, like what other (potentially hazardous) substances are in the vial. Yes, there have been instances where a vial contained a different peptide than what was ordered (there's a current example of this happening with a recent GB), but how common is that? Yes, there have been instances of drastic over or under fill (under means you're getting ripped off, but it's not dangerous. Most overfills aren't going to be dangerous either) but how common are those instances? I guess I'm just not 100% convinced that it's as necessary as many make it out to be
I do wonder what it costs for them to operate.
SmokeySquid
GLP-1 Enthusiast
I figure it’s not that common because people test as often as they do. In an unregulated market where nobody is testing I think most of these venders would be tempted to under fill, cut with something else or otherwise find ways to get more from each transaction. I do wish testing it was cheaper and more comprehensive if only to encourage even more people to test the products that are being sold to us.
geoguy78
GLP-1 Specialist
Maybe so. But it is hard to justify paying hundreds of dollars for testing and destroying a vial (moreso if you aren't buying in large quantities), especially with some of the less trendy peptides costing less for an entire kit than you pay for a test
zpped
Moderator
That's why we group together to test things. If everyone stopped testing, the vendors would start sending shit in a few weeks. It's our only power over them.
This is where it comes down to risk tolerance. You want a good deal and don’t mind the risk, don’t test it. That doesn’t make testing overrated, it means you don’t think it’s worth the money for the peace of mind you get from it personally. Others have a different relationship with risk and money.
Broken Chef
GLP-1 Specialist
The amo test with the wide range of fill is not typical from a batch. You have 20 people buying over a period of time and there's no way to know if they all came from 1 batch or 6 different batches.
As with any of the vendors, there is no way to know if they are showing you a test from the batch you get. Where the better gb's are more likely to come from one batch. There are other ways to ensure it's a custom batch. And you'll know what I mean if you get into the right gb.
If you find the right gb, I think you'll find that the range between vials tested is minimal - usually.
The reason I like 3 vial tests is so I can take an average of the fill rate and recon based on that.
How you recon and what it is might matter...
If you use say 1ml bac in a 10mg sema vial, but it happens to be 12mg, and you are dividing that into 4 doses, your 25 unit 2.5mg dose is now 3mg because you recon'd based on 10 rather than 12.
If it's 60mg tirz with 65mg in it and you divide it into 12 doses, your 5mg doses are now 5.4 ish and not a big deal.
But there are other peptides that you use 100-300mcg daily, so if a 10mg vial has 12.5mg and you recon with 1ml, that's going to throw off your dosing. If your dose is 6 units, it's already hard to be accurate. If you mistakenly go to 8 and it's over strength, you could be taking 1.5 doses.
I think it's better to be as precise as possible at all times, but maybe that's just my OCD speaking.
relliott152000
I Just Joined!
I have been reading y’all’s posts *literally since 7pm yesterday* as a complete newbie who came from (gasp!) Reddit - and holy shizz this particular formation of words you just assembled has got my head SPINNING 😂. Man, I have a lot to learn.
Broken Chef
GLP-1 Specialist
Lol, don't take my criticism of reddit newbs so seriously. I had just left a FB group because I couldn't handle the stupid questions anymore.. and I've only been at this about 5 months. I'm just disabled and spent a stupid amount of time researching, like 40+hrs/week, lol Most of what I say is from what I've read 1000 times, some from personal experience, some from common sense, some because I can and you'd really have to piss off Zip to no end to get banned from here, lol
"I just got my tirz but it's all dried up, I think it's old, is this safe, can I just add some water"?
It's simple - Prove you've done your research by not asking questions like that, or questions that were already answered 5 times in the same thread. Zero need to validate your research with me.
I'm not a senior member in any sense other than the time I've been here and the amount of posts I've made. At the rate others are contributing, there will be 100 more "senior members" in about 3 months, unless Zip changes those settings.
There were barely 1000 members here when I came in, and maybe 10-15 were active. I suppose it's partially my OCD that doesn't want to deal with 500 new people every week. I tried to help as many as I could, and even welcomed almost every single one who posted an introduction, but it's suddenly not possible. So it's more me and my OCD. As I said, I'm very much self aware and will call myself out just as fast as anyone else.
I do believe, for the most part, if you found your way here by talking to people on Reddit or on your own means, you are at least doing some research. And my fear is that there will be an abundance of FB type people going to reddit, seeing the link to here, then flooding this place with nonsense. It's hard for me personally to keep up with the influx, the previous lack of mods was concerning. It was pretty much just Zip, when he had time, and he relied on a few others to report concerning content. I do hope that the current mods, and perhaps more, will become an ongoing thing. They tend to be more level headed than me, and have more experience, as Zip said in his recent posts.
But I'm glad I was able to open your eyes a bit, and if nothing else, you can see where my concern comes from.
I am split on Dionysos's spreadsheets. I think they are helpful to newcomers, but I don't think most heed the disclaimer that it's meerly a starting point, not carved in stone. Things can go wrong that we don't learn about until 1-2 months later. If 200 people a day come in here and order from Amo, then 2 months later we learn there was an issue, there could be thousands of people who got screwed, in 1 way it another. An extreme scenario, but makes a point.
As Zip says, NONE of the vendors here or even mentioned here are "Endorsed" by the forum. This is critical info that I think a lot of people ignore, or don't even bother to read, and is why EWB and others are so critical of the spreadsheets. It does border shilling. I know that's not Dionysos's intent, but in this world of chaos and scams, everything is scrutinized.
That said, I will admit that I too based my very first purchase off of that spreadsheet when it was first formed. But only after talking extensively with Dionysos and others, and before I even got here. Once I learned he loves his wife, lol, and I even asked him that, I chose to order from the place he used for HER peptides. But that was a judgement call on my part and my own ass if it didn't pan out. I fear others might be more prone to put the blame on him if there was a problem... Or even the forum for allowing it. In a world of constant frivolous lawsuits, you can't be too careful.
I have talked with him extensively, and he does take those sheets very seriously and does all he can to keep them current. But no 1 person is perfect , and even with the few others that contribute, things can be missed and, as I said, there can be issues we don't learn about until months later. Personally, I won't order from Amo and don't see the draw. The only thing I see they excel at is expedited shipping. If that's someone's main concern, along with being cheaper than domestic, then I don't think they've done enough research. It's an Amazon mentality... I want it NOW! Not saying Amo has bad products, just that my research led me to other options that I personally see as MUCH better.
moonpies4misfits
GLP-1 Specialist
I've only been here about two and a half months and I'm feeling this too. Pretty sure the member count has almost doubled in that time. At least 400 new members in the last few weeks. The main reasons this became my favorite forum was the fact that everyone here had at least a remedial understanding of how this world works and I was actually able to learn without having to scroll through countless "why is there powder in my vial" and so on.
Not that I have an issue with this forum gaining traction in general. I just hope that all the new members do some reading before immediately posting questions.
