Sure, give away all their secrets.
scamsite
- Thread starter Transformation777
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Fisherman2356
GLP-1 Member
Random question: Has anyone heard of these two? trevogrumab and garetosmab? and does anyone know if they are available yet on grey market and if so can you list a reliable source for them. Apparently, they protect muscle loss while on GLP1's, or better yet they actually help gain muscle while you keep losing fat (on GLP1's)
thanks,
thanks,
peptideusername
Moderator
You're not going to find those on the grey market any time soon, if ever.
The -mab means "monoclonal antibody" which are considerably more difficult to make than lowly peptides.
The wide availability of glp1s and adjacent compounds makes it easy to think that every new drug coming out will have a grey market version, but that's not true.
Even if our Chinese friends could whip up a -mab, I don't think I'd touch it.
StonePny
GLP-1 Novice
People (like me) who are newer to this forum have a more unique bird's-eye view of the longer time posters, because I've been reading and scouring here for a while.
I see past and recent threads and get a pretty good feel for what someone is--
You are even-handed and thoughtful, and don't seem to have an agenda or hard-on for or against anyone (pots calling kettles black, imo). I find value in what you have to say.
For what it's worth, when you're like a dog with a damned bone over one vendor and come after anyone with a criticism of said vendor, you lose ALL CREDIBILITY. In my opinion.
Fisherman2356
GLP-1 Member
I guess I'll check with my Indian friends if they are making them yet. Buy all my meds from India at fraction of a cost, usually 5-10% of what you'd pay here in US.
StonePny
GLP-1 Novice
She was right about 1 thing. You DO have a lot of patience.
Fisherman2356
GLP-1 Member
I found this one, but looks kind of sketchy... what do you think?
StonePny
GLP-1 Novice
There's a vendor at my farmer's market called "Areolla Farms" and I giggle every time I pass it. Also, I can't buy anything from them because of the name.
StonePny
GLP-1 Novice
Hi Xanza, I think what's happening is there's a new requirement (if you go to "Introduce Yourself" there's a highlighted must read dealie). You need to post an introduction before you can post in all the threads, or so it seems.
We only have cheap peptides because they are relatively simple molecules and there have been decades of work on making machines that can churn them out in industrial quantities.
This is what semaglutide looks like in diagram form. It is 31 amino acids in a branched chain.
This is sema as a space-filled 3d model, showing what it looks like folded up.
And this is what IgG4 looks like. It is 452 amino acids and the molecule is 13x bigger by weight. It's also composed of multiple sub-units.
Any antibody is a crazy complex molecule and unlike semaglutide, they simply cannot be made by a machine that costs as much as a used car. They will be much more expensive to produce for the foreseeable future.
We have upcoming "small molecule" GLP1 drugs...
These should be cheaper to make than peptides at industrial scale, but they may be out of reach of our current peptide providers -- you just need totally different equipment to make them.
Peptide synthesis is kind of like 3d printing. You cannot make everything you might want, but the process is incredibly flexible and cheap so long as your project is suited to the technology.
This is what semaglutide looks like in diagram form. It is 31 amino acids in a branched chain.
This is sema as a space-filled 3d model, showing what it looks like folded up.
And this is what IgG4 looks like. It is 452 amino acids and the molecule is 13x bigger by weight. It's also composed of multiple sub-units.
Any antibody is a crazy complex molecule and unlike semaglutide, they simply cannot be made by a machine that costs as much as a used car. They will be much more expensive to produce for the foreseeable future.
We have upcoming "small molecule" GLP1 drugs...
These should be cheaper to make than peptides at industrial scale, but they may be out of reach of our current peptide providers -- you just need totally different equipment to make them.
Peptide synthesis is kind of like 3d printing. You cannot make everything you might want, but the process is incredibly flexible and cheap so long as your project is suited to the technology.
How about when it’s coming from the other direction. There are folks who come out of the woodwork with gushing praise whenever a specific vendor is brought up like a dog with a bone; do they lose ALL CREDIBILITY as well?
raw_oyster_eater
lemon bottle brewer
please list all the vendors you hate. I need to know where to get my stuff.
lol here’s a case in point.
Calm Logic
GLP-1 Specialist
I assume it would be a substantial list, including footnotes about being ripped off and plenty of lackluster experiences.
I think part of the challenge is the lack of data provided when rating-
If I said X company sold me peps that tested poorly, or did not deliver, or fill in the blank and it was corroborated by many- think the star system or trust pilot-
Then it would be easier to understand.
The more info I get about X vendor the more it makes sense why someone might have had a bad experience.
I agree Bee, the shilling is taking advantage of the platform in hopes of creating a false narrative to attract new buyers.
I also think people legitimately like their dealer- he's cool and took care of me.
I truly believe either side of that fence without supportive data makes the narrative less credible and strengthens the skepticism of the review, good or bad.
A few years ago I saw Marc Randolph keynote and it amazes me the mistakes blockbuster made. This story is repeated time and time again about failures that eventually became leaders.
I think it is when they put the thumb on the scale, think Edison vs Tesla, that it creates more passion to hate on someone.
It appears that is the case with this particular individual- not only the production failures, the alleged lack of safety protocols, but perhaps most importantly the shilling.
There's definitely companies in China that can (and do) produce monoclonal antibodies.
But our drug dealers aren't going to be able to get it at a price from them that makes sense when their hands are already full handling legit pharma production. I expect it could happen - the legitimate manufacturers for all sorts of things turn around and sell to the grey/black market - but it wouldn't be economically viable for the client base they're targeting.
Fisherman2356
GLP-1 Member
What do you mean? they wouldn't sell without a prescription?
Fisherman2356
GLP-1 Member
Yeah, the price is pretty steep but if the dosage is small (i.e couple mg per week, don't even know what dosage) I could see myself coughing up 1G to gain some muscle while also losing weight at same time. so many unknowns at this time. but wanted to throw it out there and see if anyone knows more...
You make some excellent points.
One of the most frustrating parts of this is when he first showed up requesting to be listed as a vendor here, I engaged in an extended conversation with him compared to most vendors because there had already been a few public problems stemming from his attempt to appear to be a Chinese vendor, trying to appear to be two different people, as well has his associations with various less-than-reputable characters in the "community". I took his explanations and representations at face value and told him as much, and decided to recognize him as a vendor. I still had my reservations but figured time would tell if he was going to change his ways or continue to be shady, and most of the time the community is pretty good at fleshing out the worst of the worst.
I've never understood why any vendor has to lower themselves to encouraging people to shill for them. As a number of other vendors have demonstrated over and over again, when you're good people are going to talk about you positively without any encouragement or incentive. However the moment you incentivize people in any way, both the perception and reality of honest reviews are completely destroyed. What's even more ironic is many of the biggest names in the business have had spectacular failures at some point, yet their responses were so well-executed that they usually manage to turn those failures into positives. In the end, the guy may be an "ok" drug dealer, but he's clearly not a very good businessman.
It's frustrating for me to have to deal with it at all. I enjoy seeing new members join and participate, but sadly I have had to dedicate so much time to dealing with all the shitty humans (well beyond this one person/company) that I don't get to engage with them nearly as much as I would like to.
Perhaps the most poignant irony to this all is since retiring and having more time to spend here, for the most part I've had little interest in reading or learning about what kind of vendor drama has been going on during my absence and had no clue what was going on with scamsite beyond knowing a couple of threads were pretty active. I was happy to leave it all to the community to figure out; that was until the floodgates of shills opened up.
They sell to licensed professionals, primarily (actual professional) researchers. Any order to a residential address is automatically cancelled, and they look up the business/organization they are sending to to verify it is legitimate.
Even if you have a prescription for something they do not sell to individuals.
You would not even get a single dose for $1k. Trial dosing ranged from .3mg/kg to 10mg/kg via IV. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32557665/ - and if you meant getting a gram, that's probably $50k+
Human results on these were also not nearly as interesting as the monkey results, though it still potentially holds promise for muscle growth.
In the phase 1b trials, the best results came from combined trevogrumab/garetosmab + semaglutide and there was no muscle gain. They did lose 25lb of fat and only 2lb of muscle, compared to 15/8 on semaglutide alone, but it's not like the monkey trials where they just packed on muscle while also losing weight.
StonePny
GLP-1 Novice
I have seen it lately, so yes. You may have misunderstood what I meant, the gushers who get virulent at hearing criticism are the dogs with the bone that can't be pried away. It is one and the same person.
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I have been very impressed with your, and your teams, handling of this and all things related to running this very challenging forum. Not only is our community dealing with potential risks with health, but also money, and time.
I appreciate the altruistic and level handed approach to these things and know I am not as well versed on the history or all ramifications of this hobby.
I think the clarifications lend to better understanding the passion behind your choices.
This hobby ain't dummy proof
Fisherman2356
GLP-1 Member
OUCH! LOL
Thanks for digging it up.
Super Trips
GLP-1 Enthusiast
Gets one or 2 bad vials = I throw out the vials and move on with my life
Gets ripped off for the entire order from china = It causes my anger sharks to start swimming in my head and get in a road rage fight 30 mins later on my way to mcdonalds to eat my feelings cause shit aint going right.
every vendor has had a bad moment. When i first posted about cain on here the hate was all over from his past on Meso or the other forum. Then the china drama went down he was one of the only places to get stuff without being ripped off. Now things are back to normal its cain is the devil again and we now think pricing is more important than cain was here when we needed him.
Gets ripped off for the entire order from china = It causes my anger sharks to start swimming in my head and get in a road rage fight 30 mins later on my way to mcdonalds to eat my feelings cause shit aint going right.
every vendor has had a bad moment. When i first posted about cain on here the hate was all over from his past on Meso or the other forum. Then the china drama went down he was one of the only places to get stuff without being ripped off. Now things are back to normal its cain is the devil again and we now think pricing is more important than cain was here when we needed him.
I would say past performance does not guarantee future results, both good and bad.
I am not riding any good or bad team- but based on what i am seeing, hearing, and understand- I am not sure it is wise to give a guy a pass for something if currently he is failing to perform- test or no test that NAD looked horrible and the cardboard was scary too.
That is just the QC issue-
Add to that the 200+ new accounts and the handling of the NAD deal (which personally I believe should be refunded) and it becomes a "current" issue not and "old" one.
Vendors are good until they are not good. Maybe he can regain rep, but not this way.
IMHO
gothpeacock
GLP-1 Novice
You saw that Dr Mike video too huh lol he got me all jazzed about it and then I realized they’re monoclonal antibodies and they’ll be v expensive and hard for UGLs to replicate
chmuse
Public Nuisance 🦜🐧🦅🦚🦃🦢🐓🦆🦉
God Bee put up with so much shit from us 😩😂
Testing to see if it's a forum thing or if everyone is just doing it to be funny:
Nexa
scamsite
Cain
Baba
I am cracking up
Calm Logic
GLP-1 Specialist
I'll start saving now for a future pre-order, haha.
Right now, one can buy R20 from SRY's US Warehouse for $200. Or pre-order R24 for $400 with scamsite (with vendor-managed group testing). So if money is tight at all...or if one rather pay for their own testing...
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