Your SSA Experience…

[desinr-gal]

You know, I used to think the same regarding the lower mg tirzepatide kits. However, I can see the value of peace of mind if you are someone who worries about bacterial growth in vials that you'd be using post-28 days. Or, in another situation, if one needed to reconstitute with sterile water instead of bac water, a single-dose vial is ideal. Or, say you're just starting out, or highly sensitive to GLP1s. There are all kinds of uses for those lower mg vials. 🙂

After hearing Peter Magic say dont use them beyond 4wks, I tossed my still half full vial of Tirz that was well beyond one month in use. I am regretting buying the kits of T30s.. because I am still on a low dose..

 

[byefatlicia]

I tossed my still half full vial of Tirz that was well beyond one month in use. I am regretting buying the kits of T30s.. because I am still on a low dose..

Mail them to me and I'll make sure they get disposed of "properly" 😂

 

[cheaperseeker]

Mail them to me and I'll make sure they get disposed of "properly" 😂

Same! If you happen to live within a few hours of SE Iowa, I'll come and pick them up!

Seriously though, when I worked in long-term care, we only ever threw out medication vials after 28 days if we knew state would be coming for an inspection soon (Not great, I know. Don't get me started on how effed up our medical system is.). There was never an issue with ISRs or ineffective meds. This is not medical advice, just my experience.

 

[Calm Logic]

To reduce punctures, you can split into multiple vials after recon, or switch to using pens.

 

[cheaperseeker]

To reduce punctures for high-strength vials, you can split into multiple vials after recon, or switch to using pens.

This! I just switched to pens and they have made my life so much easier.

 

[desinr-gal]

Same! If you happen to live within a few hours of SE Iowa, I'll come and pick them up!

Seriously though, when I worked in long-term care, we only ever threw out medication vials after 28 days if we knew state would be coming for an inspection soon (Not great, I know. Don't get me started on how effed up our medical system is.). There was never an issue with ISRs or ineffective meds. This is not medical advice, just my experience.

I was given two reconstituted vials from a Compounding pharmacy. I used the first over 2-3 months and had been on the second for over a month. So between the original compounding date in april and the first usage date (I dose every other day, so many more cap pokes) I got worried. Though I have never even had an ISR. I didnt want to push my luck. I am not throwing away the t30 vials haha. But Next round I will get the lower dosage ones. I just read through BAC water studies and I feel more confident about BAC.

 

[desinr-gal]

This! I just switched to pens and they have made my life so much easier.

I am still waiting for my pens..They were shipped by slow boat to Hawaii via USPS by error since priority mail had been paid for. aaargghh.
However. Pen cart caps are still perforated each use, just like the vials. And if you leave the needles on, you are exposing your peptide to outside air that whole time.

 

[Calm Logic]

Pen cart caps are still perforated each use, just like the vials.

Yes, but.... "The surface of the vial's rubber stopper is much larger and more exposed than the tiny septum of a pen cartridge" (Google Gemini). And a reusable pen is a more closed system in general, e.g. not requiring air to be inserted.

The worst experience I had with a vial was a vial of B-12. I punctured it at least eight times already, but I somehow made a semi-leaky hole with a small 31-g needle. So I guess I hit the same spot at least twice or did something else to core the vial. (For a thick needle, like a 18-g fill needle, it is best to use a 45-degree insertion angle into the vial, with the bevel side up.)

 

[desinr-gal]

Yes, but.... "The surface of the vial's rubber stopper is much larger and more exposed than the tiny septum of a pen cartridge" (Google Gemini). And a reusable pen is a more closed system in general, e.g. not requiring air to be inserted.

The worst experience I had with a vial was a vial of B-12. I punctured it at least eight times already, but I somehow made a semi-leaky hole with a small 31-g needle. So I guess I hit the same spot at least twice or did something else to core the vial. (For a thick needle, like a 18-g fill needle, it is best to use a 45-degree insertion angle into the vial, with the bevel side up.)

Yikes. The coring potential is real, There is an NIH study I read on that. You could argue that since the cart cap gets repeatedly punctured in the same spot, the risk may be greater. whereas the larger vial cap area means less likelihood of hitting the same spot and coring it. I bought the older V1 type pens so I can keep it fully closed. I've never used them and Im looking forward to it.

 

[indolent]

After hearing Peter Magic say dont use them beyond 4wks, I tossed my still half full vial of Tirz that was well beyond one month in use. I am regretting buying the kits of T30s.. because I am still on a low dose..

Peter Magic didn't (at least in the Rory interview recently posted) say that.

He said, off the cuff, that risk of injection site reaction might increase with potential microbial growth. He was probably referring to vials reconned with saline or sterile water (which is what's available in the rest of the world) rather than bacteriostatic water (which includes benzyl alcohol to suppress microbial growth).

He mentioned 2-4 weeks as his ideal usage period.

I'm sticking with 3 months, and considering refreezing weekly bc why not.

 

[Calm Logic]

You could argue that since the cart cap gets repeatedly punctured in the same spot, the risk may be greater. whereas the larger vial cap area means less likelihood of hitting the same spot and coring it.

Yes, I considered that too, but now Google Gemini says:

While it looks like a pen cartridge is subjected to repeated punctures in the same spot, the combination of its advanced, self-sealing material, the extremely fine, single-use needle, and the controlled, perpendicular insertion provided by the pen's design makes it far less prone to coring than a multi-use vial, where the process is more susceptible to human error and a wider range of potential variables.

 

[desinr-gal]

I hope Gemini is correct. 🙂

 

[Jack brown]

If Peter Magic is comfortable with 4 weeks on STERILE water then I think 8 weeks with bacteriostatic water should be ok...

 

[byefatlicia]

Go with your gut reaction...

 

[randompersonrandom]

Dangit, I JUST posted pen-angst in a whole separate thread a few hours ago, because I couldn't find any conversations about whether or not a pen could make a high-dose vial work better for someone on a low dose....and now HERE'S the conversation I've been hoping to eavesdrop on, in the damn SSA thread! I can't with all y'all. 😂

 

[vewdew34]

This! I just switched to pens and they have made my life so much easier.

Amen to that love my pens, time savers and easy.

 

[vewdew34]

I am still waiting for my pens..They were shipped by slow boat to Hawaii via USPS by error since priority mail had been paid for. aaargghh.
However. Pen cart caps are still perforated each use, just like the vials. And if you leave the needles on, you are exposing your peptide to outside air that whole time.

You telling me you would reuse a needle?

 

[randompersonrandom]

You telling me you would reuse a needle?

I think she means you swap the needle after using and store with a fresh, capped needle on it, which some people do but most people agree is a bad idea.

 

[desinr-gal]

You telling me you would reuse a needle?

No. Sorry I wasn't clear. Some users add the new needle ahead of time, as was suggested by the pen seller, for convenience.

 

[desinr-gal]

To reduce punctures, you can split into multiple vials after recon, or switch to using pens.

good idea!

 

[desinr-gal]

Peter Magic didn't (at least in the Rory interview recently posted) say that.

He said, off the cuff, that risk of injection site reaction might increase with potential microbial growth. He was probably referring to vials reconned with saline or sterile water (which is what's available in the rest of the world) rather than bacteriostatic water (which includes benzyl alcohol to suppress microbial growth).

He mentioned 2-4 weeks as his ideal usage period.

I'm sticking with 3 months, and considering refreezing weekly bc why not.

I watched it and I'm pretty sure he did say the safest thing is to toss after 4 wks regardless of type of water, because bacteria can be growing inside (I am paraphrasing) That's why you should only get smallest dose vials that will be used up in that time frame. Now whether the risk is isr vs a systemic infection, is something I dont want to get wrong.

I had read somewhere that its not good to refreeze??

 

[Calm Logic]

The only reason I haven't bought from SSA is their MOQ. But there is a group on Discord that does collective buying from SSA to avoid the MOQ issue.

I hope Gemini is correct. 🙂

I think so. The few papers on coring of the septum of insulin pen cartridges are mostly in Japanese or bad English, and they are using microscopic imaging.

In an older post (not in this SSA thread, haha), it was mentioned that some new, cheap vials from Amazon leak anyway:

The cheapest on Amazon are junk and leak.

So I bought Hospira-brand empty vials after reading that.

I haven't seen anything yet about leaking pen cartridges. Is that a thing? I sometimes use disposable pens of liraglutide from India, and they never leak.