How many people do you think are going gray for their supply?

[Chili777]

This is exactly what happened to me. As soon as I googled I had ads popping up on Facebook, TikTok, etc. for the single vial sellers.

What I find hilarious is that all these companies are the same ones running ads all over Reddit, too. Yet you can't mention them in the subs. 😆

 

[Foggy-Hollow]

I actually disagree with that.
Remember that these numbers are based solely on BMI and the US has a very large population of fitness fanatics. Heavily muscled men and women have higher BMIs and are often counted as being obese.

Yes, these are some of the same people that decry BMI as a poor tool.

Yet I’m willing to bet they’re not getting any sort of body fat testing (much less paying up for an accurate test) to back up that claim.

InBody puts my arms at 135th %ile for amount of muscle for a woman. I’m obese, both from BMI and body fat percentage. If I maintain lean body mass, I could get 10 pounds below top end of healthy-BMI before having to consider I might be getting into “athletic” body fat percentages.

In other words it takes a LOT of muscle to truly be BMI-overweight and body-fat athletic.

I used to be a believer that I was one of those until the time I got into “healthy” weight and knew I had plenty of fat left to lose.

 

[Chili777]

Yes, these are some of the same people that decry BMI as a poor tool.

Yet I’m willing to bet they’re not getting any sort of body fat testing (much less paying up for an accurate test) to back up that claim.

InBody puts my arms at 135th %ile for amount of muscle for a woman. I’m obese, both from BMI and body fat percentage. If I maintain lean body mass, I could get 10 pounds below top end of healthy-BMI before having to consider I might be getting into “athletic” body fat percentages.

In other words it takes a LOT of muscle to truly be BMI-overweight and body-fat athletic.

I used to be a believer that I was one of those until the time I got into “healthy” weight and knew I had plenty of fat left to lose.

I've never put a lot of stock in BMI because of my experience. I've never been below 27 in my life. When I was 30, I had a 32" waist and a 52" chest and could bench 280, and I still had a BMI of 28. That's as close as ever got to not being "clinically obese". It's a metric defined by height and weight standards, which is fine, but I don't think it's a consistent measure of obesity to rely on and doctors are now starting to combine it with other metrics, which is good.

 

[HZM808]

I think most start local and from there it's a natural progression to the gray market. I'd venture to guess, gray market popped up peoples radar when they were googling things like dosing. I know it did for me. Both YT and Reddit. Reddit is where I learnt about this forum.

Pretty much verbatim how it went for me!

 

[Foggy-Hollow]

I've never put a lot of stock in BMI because of my experience. I've never been below 27 in my life. When I was 30, I had a 32" waist and a 52" chest and could bench 280, and I still had a BMI of 28. That's as close as ever got to not being "clinically obese". It's a metric defined by height and weight standards, which is fine, but I don't think it's a consistent measure of obesity to rely on and doctors are now starting to combine it with other metrics, which is good.

BMI was developed by the insurance industry as a measure of risk. Higher BMI means higher likelihood of adverse health events. It’s a large count, statistical measure. For the broader population it’s by definition telling them it’s not healthy to be heavy.

Here’s the newer measures being developed (lancet link) for anyone interested: https://www.thelancet.com/infographics-do/clinical-obesity-25

Here’s an article from AP, they seem to think the misclassification shuffle will about equal out: skinny-fat and athletic-yet-heavy trading places in the obese category.

Moving away from BMI, experts propose a new definition for obesity

New recommendations on how to define obesity would reduce the emphasis on body mass index and also take into account health problems from extra weight and other measurements.

apnews.com

Maybe you’re an exception. But it’s not common and more than a few people think they’re an exception to BMI. Body fat is a better measure.

 

[MsGizmo]

BMI was developed by the insurance industry as a measure of risk. Higher BMI means higher likelihood of adverse health events. It’s a large count, statistical measure. For the broader population it’s by definition telling them it’s not healthy to be heavy.

Here’s the newer measures being developed (lancet link) for anyone interested: https://www.thelancet.com/infographics-do/clinical-obesity-25

Here’s an article from AP, they seem to think the misclassification shuffle will about equal out: skinny-fat and athletic-yet-heavy trading places in the obese category.

Moving away from BMI, experts propose a new definition for obesity

New recommendations on how to define obesity would reduce the emphasis on body mass index and also take into account health problems from extra weight and other measurements.

apnews.com

Maybe you’re an exception. But it’s not common and more than a few people think they’re an exception to BMI. Body fat is a better measure.

Oh God, no. I am absolutely obese. No question. I never said otherwise. I just mentioned that the US also has a large number of people who take steroids and that they could be counted as obese based only on BMI. The difference between a "healthy" weight and being obese for a 6 foot tall man is only 40 pounds.

 

[DustAndDignity]

I've never put a lot of stock in BMI because of my experience. I've never been below 27 in my life. When I was 30, I had a 32" waist and a 52" chest and could bench 280, and I still had a BMI of 28. That's as close as ever got to not being "clinically obese". It's a metric defined by height and weight standards, which is fine, but I don't think it's a consistent measure of obesity to rely on and doctors are now starting to combine it with other metrics, which is good.

Agreed. During my last DEXA scan I was told I’d never fit into a healthy BMI due to my bone density and weight alone. 😅

 

[Chili777]

Agreed. During my last DEXA scan I was told I’d never fit into a healthy BMI due to my bone density and weight alone. 😅

Exactly. I have high bone density also. I had to get a knee replaced some years ago and I asked the surgeon if they kept an additional saw blade in the operating room. He laughed and said yes, they do have a spare, if needed. They needed it. He told me after the operation that it was only the third time in his career he had to use a second one. Muscle is also denser than fat, meaning it takes up less space for the same weight which skews the BMI.

 

[Retazempic]

There are 38,000 people in just one buyers group in NJ. I know of another one with ~24,000 in CA. So lots.

I’m in Jersey. If you could make the connection ….

 

[Chili777]

I’m in Jersey. If you could make the connection ….

I saw this on meso. It's another glp forum.

 

[dogmom]

I would have no idea. I have never told any family members about doing grey. They think I just took regular shots. However, in my case I was prescribed Wegovy which didn't work for me and wanted to do Mounjaro/Tirz which my insurance did not cover. I had tried Mounjaro for 2 months under the coupon period back in 2022 when it seemed like everyone was able to use that $25 coupon. So I knew that worked. Anyway, I was desperate and was willing to do whatever to get Tirz. I'm so glad I did because I lost 85lbs since then.

Anyway, even if people are buying grey, I don't think you would necessarily know. There have been so many people like me, people who lost insurance coverage, know something works, and are willing to take the risk of grey.

 

[NoTMYNAMEGIRL]

I don't know, but there are different segments that add up. And TikTok, YouTube, and Facebook make grey seem like no big deal. Type "reta vial" into Google and you get Google legitimizing grey through sponsored product listings. Facebook has a ton of ads for overpriced single vials.

As mentioned before, the med spa people are a huge percentage. And it's true that many/most people don't even know they are going grey by getting some things from a med spa.

You've got gym and steroid users using peptides, especially reta, HGH, HCG, and BPC-157. And some guys start doing TRT legally but then want higher dosing. The whole grey market really started with steroid users, is my understanding. And some Chinese vendors make more selling steroids than peptides.

Then you've got the beauty crowd that doesn't want to donate money to med spas, even doing Botox at home thanks to YouTube videos and shipments from Korea. Korea is the best source for glutathione, btw.

“Korea is the best source for glutathione, btw.” Really??? Can you elaborate? Please?

 

[Calm Logic]

“Korea is the best source for glutathione, btw.” Really??? Can you elaborate? Please?

Lyophilized glutathione from Korea is apparently gentler (less sting) for subq use (probably due to better excipients for better pH, etc). More likely to be sterile since they are made for the general public at regulated Korean facilities (not produced at underground facilities as with peptides from China).

The cost from a domestic reseller like Glow-Unique or TheBeautyDeli is $45+ for a kit of glutathione 1200 mg, plus $12 shipping. Glow-Unique is the cheaper of the two, but TheBeautyDeli sells singles for $6.

 

[Labcat]

I don't know, but there are different segments that add up. And TikTok, YouTube, and Facebook make grey seem like no big deal. Type "reta vial" into Google and you get Google legitimizing grey through sponsored product listings. Facebook has a ton of ads for overpriced single vials.

As mentioned before, the med spa people are a huge percentage. And it's true that many/most people don't even know they are going grey by getting some things from a med spa.

You've got gym and steroid users using peptides, especially reta, HGH, HCG, and BPC-157. And some guys start doing TRT legally but then want higher dosing. The whole grey market really started with steroid users, is my understanding. And some Chinese vendors make more selling steroids than peptides.

Then you've got the beauty crowd that doesn't want to donate money to med spas, even doing Botox at home thanks to YouTube videos and shipments from Korea. Korea is the best source for glutathione, btw.

I agree that it’s likely tons of people will get into this without understanding the seriousness of what they’re soing. I mean, when did “med spa”, casual botox and fillers, and casual IV clinics running all sorts of things into your veins… become widely accepted everywhere, run by who knows who wearing scrubs? Once peptides become popular culture it might slide under all regulatory control, and people pop peptides like they use supplements (what even are all those bottles promising everything in shops and online?)

 

[FlowerFairy]

I don't know, but there are different segments that add up. And TikTok, YouTube, and Facebook make grey seem like no big deal. Type "reta vial" into Google and you get Google legitimizing grey through sponsored product listings. Facebook has a ton of ads for overpriced single vials.

As mentioned before, the med spa people are a huge percentage. And it's true that many/most people don't even know they are going grey by getting some things from a med spa.

You've got gym and steroid users using peptides, especially reta, HGH, HCG, and BPC-157. And some guys start doing TRT legally but then want higher dosing. The whole grey market really started with steroid users, is my understanding. And some Chinese vendors make more selling steroids than peptides.

Then you've got the beauty crowd that doesn't want to donate money to med spas, even doing Botox at home thanks to YouTube videos and shipments from Korea. Korea is the best source for glutathione, btw.

You think they’re better than India? Give me deets! I’ve been very happy with my $8/box glutathione..

 

[Calm Logic]

You think they’re better than India? Give me deets! I’ve been very happy with my $8/box glutathione..

All the cool kids say Korea.

As long as it recons well and has a vacuum you are doing better than the vial I got from India. I threw it out due to bad vibes. The one from China was better and perfect for IM. But will try Korea next.

 

[FlowerFairy]

All the cool kids say Korea.

As long as it recons well and has a vacuum you are doing better than the vial I got from India. I threw it out due to bad vibes. The one from China was better and perfect for IM. But will try Korea next.

I’ve never used gluta from China, only India. Does Korean glutathione come with vitamin c for recon? Dm me some Korean websites? The glutathione from India is spicy.. I’ve resorted to adding a few units of lido..

 

[Calm Logic]

I’ve never used gluta from China, only India. Does Korean glutathione come with vitamin c for recon? Dm me some Korean websites? The glutathione from India is spicy.. I’ve resorted to adding a few units of lido..

Since vitamin C only adds to the spicy sting, I just take oral vitamin C so far and recon with just BAC. Will try saline BAC next time.

The Koreans make/sell the vitamin C separately, usually in vials. For that, TheBeautyDeli website is best since Glow-Unique doesn't sell vitamin C for injection.

 

[FlowerFairy]

Since vitamin C only adds to the spicy sting, I just take oral vitamin C so far and recon with just BAC. Will try saline BAC next time.

The Koreans make/sell the vitamin C separately, usually in vials. For that, TheBeautyDeli website is best since Glow-Unique doesn't sell vitamin C for injection.

I can always get the vitamin C for injection from India.
And I had one vial that refused to recon with just vitamin C serum and I had to add bac.. that one stung worse than just reconning w/the vitamin C. I don’t think I’ve ever used one just reconned with bac.. maybe I’ll try it.

 

[HZM808]

All the cool kids say Korea.

Glow-Unique is the cheaper of the two

That's been all the same talk on a DIY beauty board....can I name other boards? China stingy, Korea best, pink cap esp. but haven't been able to find that...only green.

It's $60 on AceCosm and a coupon code if anyone wants, it looks like the exact box but $45 is even better. "topical only" is akin to "not for human use" on this? Ace isn't bothering with that so just want to make sure it isn't like the copper with two kinds, inj. and cosm. Also, seeing the credit card icons...is that straight up cc or Wise?

I do have a full cart in AceCosm though...so I may just use them to keep it simple. Simple, ha! 😛 Every time I decide I'm set on what I want to do, someone shows me something new and shiny 👀👀. In 8 months I've gone from starting Dr. prescribed Tirz to other gray market peps and now planning to inject my own face in the name of beauty. Starting slow, though, with Dr.Pen and a variety of skin boosters, peels, and some diy skincare on my Black Friday haul. Very excited.

 

[Calm Logic]

That's been all the same talk on a DIY beauty board....can I name other boards? China stingy, Korea best, pink cap esp. but haven't been able to find that...only green.

It's $60 on AceCosm and a coupon code if anyone wants, it looks like the exact box but $45 is even better. "topical only" is akin to "not for human use" on this? Ace isn't bothering with that so just want to make sure it isn't like the copper with two kinds, inj. and cosm. Also, seeing the credit card icons...is that straight up cc or Wise?

I do have a full cart in AceCosm though...so I may just use them to keep it simple. Simple, ha! 😛 Every time I decide I'm set on what I want to do, someone shows me something new and shiny 👀👀. In 8 months I've gone from starting Dr. prescribed Tirz to other gray market peps and now planning to inject my own face in the name of beauty. Starting slow, though, with Dr.Pen and a variety of skin boosters, peels, and some diy skincare on my Black Friday haul. Very excited.

Yes, you can name them.

And I was going to post the same thing today, so thanks for confirming it: The pink box/brand (Glutaone) is preferred over the green, even at Reddit. Because the pink brand is a better brand or less sting or whatever. Glow-Unique's website does not even bother selling the green boxes.

Recon for Korean brands is said to be fine with 3 mL of BAC (400 mg/mL), but IM rather than subq is the standard on the Korean boxes (along with IV). Even at a high concentration of 400 mg/ML, doing IM gluta did not sting and no ISR.

IM is easy and painless for me in the thigh thanks to Nurse Scott on Youtube, using the vl (vastus lateralis) muscle in the thigh. His best tip is to cough as a distraction while jabbing yourself. I prefer 1" 27g needle:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CS3S9GVB

I injected the China this morning subq (thigh) and it was fine going in but there was a small, temporary ISR/lump even at a very low concentration (about 150 mg/mL). My first subq with the China stung somewhat going in at 400 mg/mL but the bigger issue was a large lump that went away upon waking (injected at night).

I got my single China vial from BioBombshell since it was 2400 mg and in a large bottle. But Korea is cheaper, more trustworthy, and likely better for subq than China. China was perfect for IM though, with IM being the standard at clinics rather than subq.