Do You Filter Your Peptides Before Use?

[AndyPanda]

I filter my peptides subcutaneously. It’s utterly necessary! They’ve done studies you know. 60% of the time, it works every time.

 

[Calm Logic]

Andy, your profile picture looks angrier than usual

Do most of the compounding pharmacies filter?

 

[AndyPanda]

Andy, your profile picture looks angrier than usual

Do most of the compounding pharmacies filter?

That’s a good question. I’ve never been on compounded, or brand name.

 

[penewbie]

Hospira recommends against refrigeration because they want you to throw the bottle out after a single use. Refrigeration extends benzyl alcohol potency from about 28 days to 6weeks or more based in published studies. Syringe filtering grey market stuff is utterly critical to maintain safety from stray particles and bacterial contamination. You can get away with stabbing yourself with dirty needles many times, but eventually you’ll get the crud.

Please link to those published studies.

 

[Augu5+1ne]

I filter my peptides subcutaneously. It’s utterly necessary! They’ve done studies you know. 60% of the time, it works every time.

You are ridiculously seething over a clear safety issue. With nearly a thousand posts, it's time for you to get off the forum, as you are here merely to larp as an experienced guru without any underlying expertise.

 

[Augu5+1ne]

Please link to those published studies.

why don't you do your own research when there are numerous easy ways to do it? Since you call yourself a research enthusiast especially. Studies like these are easily found:

Wilson et al. (2000) (Infection Control and Hospital Epidemiology, 2000;21(5):345-348)
Palaria et.al. Journal of Clinical and Diagnostic Research, 2018;12(9) DC01-DC05.

 

[Augu5+1ne]

Filtering is essentially an insurance policy, is it most likely wasted money? Probably, is it possible that it can save your ass from potentially getting sick? Sure. What are the odds it saves you, probably below 1%.

My favorite concepts in math are cost/benefit analysis of insurance design, but in the world of insurance, it's going to be different than say an extended warranty, as the manufacturer's warranty generally has the highest occurrence of use vs. the extended warranty.

Why are extended warranties generally bad? You generally will pay around 10-20% of the item's value over the course of say 3X the length of the normal warranty. For electronics in particular, around 90-95% of defects in manufacturing occur as issues within the normal warranty period. In fact, if you make it past the first 6 months, odds are of the electronic failing are below 5% in the next 5-10 years of normal use. This also doesn't account for a depreciation asset cost, so the replacement cost of the item is most likely to be around the cost of the extended warranty in 5 years time.

I can dig up my source, but I worked in the semiconductor industry, and our 90 day quality testing mirrored these kinds of results (you can simulate humid/not fun temperate environments to speed up "aging" for electronics).


Let's look at filters and purely math:
Let's say we aim for 0.1% chance something is going to be funky in your vial that might cause you an adverse reaction that WOULD be filtered out (that is 1 in 1000 vials, probably not a crazy estimate).

For this situation, let's take a mid-range household salary for the US (around $60,000), and let's take a small illness (maybe like 2 days off of work because you feel like crap, not "I need to go to a clinic" crap, just "I can't work" crap)

Those 2 days vs. a roughly 200 days of work/year come out to 1% of your pay, or $600.

So how much does 1 filter cost? I would say around $1.50 looking around at prices (probably a little less in bulk)

Simple math here, 0.001(chance you got a bad vial)* $600(cost of lost work) = $0.60 of risk.

If the cost of risk > cost of the filter, then you should filter.

For myself, I err on the side of more conservative risk, so I would probably put like 0.25% chance instead of 0.1% chance because I'm a chicken, and I also make more than the average salary in the US, so for me, the cost of the risk is higher than the cost of the filter.

That was a fun validation of "Should I do Shit?". Stay tuned for the "Should I eat that?" math!

You are a fat clown, here to attention seek rather to provide information. Here's a study showing that about 25% of vials get contaminated on repeated access:

A pilot study for evaluation of knowledge and common... : Journal of Education and Health Promotion

al contamination rate. SETTINGS AND DESIGN: A pilot study was conducted in a super-specialty hospital from June to December 2016. SUBJECTS AND METHODS: Information about knowledge and common practises of 100 nursing staff posted in various Intensive Care Units (ICUs) with respect to the usage...

journals.lww.com

 

[Calm Logic]

@Augu5+1ne , do you also favor putting a filter on a vent needle? I know @scarywood75 does: "If you add outside air in the vial, you ruined it a bit."

 

[Cndmk]

You are a fat clown, here to attention seek rather to provide information. Here's a study showing that about 25% of vials get contaminated on repeated access:

A pilot study for evaluation of knowledge and common... : Journal of Education and Health Promotion

al contamination rate. SETTINGS AND DESIGN: A pilot study was conducted in a super-specialty hospital from June to December 2016. SUBJECTS AND METHODS: Information about knowledge and common practises of 100 nursing staff posted in various Intensive Care Units (ICUs) with respect to the usage...

journals.lww.com

Woah I bet you really wow the kids at parties.

I’m a statistics and science guy who has worked in semiconductor production and bio-pharma production, what have you done?

Let’s break what you said down and what you are implying by linking this study:
- Contamination implies “you are going to have an adverse reaction.” Incorrect on so many levels. Cars can go without an oil change for 30,000 miles and not suffer an adverse reaction. Is that a good idea? No, can you predict each individual responses? No.

- as it’s obvious you don’t really understand statistically relevant versus data, your phone has a HUGE level of contamination, in fact all of our phones probably do (that’s just data). People who have a reaction to this contamination (statistically relevant) is most likely well below 1%, which could be caused by lower immune systems, worse hygiene, already sick, etc.

filters are designed to prevent statistically relevant outcomes that apply to the filtering process (small bacteria/foreign materials existing in the source). Filters are NOT designed to stop re-sticking a vial and the contamination subsequent to that.

The rules of:
- Don’t use BAC water past 30/60 days once punctured
- Don’t use peptides past 30/60 days once reconstituted + punctured
- Clean the cap prior to every stick with alcohol pad

Those rules exist to lower your chance of a statistically relevant event related to contamination which is NORMAL in use.

Many people go well beyond these limits and are just fine, because we make rules based on high risk aversion.

Many fantastic independent studies in this community have been done even on peptide degradation that drastically go over recommended maximum frozen storage levels (2-3 years) proving that risks are relatively low on using product frozen for even 4-5 years. I bet by your thought process there is a 25% chance those people must have keeled over by now

 

[AndyPanda]

You are ridiculously seething over a clear safety issue. With nearly a thousand posts, it's time for you to get off the forum, as you are here merely to larp as an experienced guru without any underlying expertise.

Dude, go away. You are a crybaby. You come on here with your limited knowledge and vocabulary and then cry when you get picked on for not being able to properly articulate. Nobody wants to hear you pontificate.

 

[AndyPanda]

You are a fat clown, here to attention seek rather to provide information. Here's a study showing that about 25% of vials get contaminated on repeated access:

A pilot study for evaluation of knowledge and common... : Journal of Education and Health Promotion

al contamination rate. SETTINGS AND DESIGN: A pilot study was conducted in a super-specialty hospital from June to December 2016. SUBJECTS AND METHODS: Information about knowledge and common practises of 100 nursing staff posted in various Intensive Care Units (ICUs) with respect to the usage...

journals.lww.com

Now you are calling people fat, on a GLP1 forum where they are trying to improve themselves?

 

[Calm Logic]

Now you are calling people fat, on a GLP1 forum where they are trying to improve themselves?

That was shockingly bad and weird.

I thought maybe he would remove it when he calmed down. Nope.

 

[Skidude]

Dude, go away. You are a crybaby. You come on here with your limited knowledge and vocabulary and then cry when you get picked on for not being able to properly articulate. Nobody wants to hear you pontificate.

And here I thought he owned stock in a filter selling website from the timing and content of these posts..lol

maybe just a troll?

 

[Calm Logic]

More likely OCD. I have OCD, so I recognize my people

 

[penewbie]

And here I thought he owned stock in a filter selling website from the timing and content of these posts..lol

maybe just a troll?

For sure.

He used ChatGPT to generate some article links. lol.

 

[Calm Logic]

He used ChatGPT to generate some article links. lol.

ChatGPT can do that on its own or used to, which is another reason I prefer Google Gemini.

 

[hexagonal]

Wearing a mask in public is a sign of submission to propaganda and mental illness. lol

Or just wanting to not spread your germs around because it's a considerate thing to do.

People have been doing it in Japan and Korea for long before it became political or covid-19 related.



Anyway, another reason to consider filtering is that we have fairly good data that suggests that subclinical infections can directly contribute to developing arthritis, e.g. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4131749/

So you might never get a symptomatic infection from unfiltered peptides but you could be increasing your risk of developing RA in the long run.

 

[chmuse]

why don't you do your own research when there are numerous easy ways to do it? Since you call yourself a research enthusiast especially. Studies like these are easily found:

Wilson et al. (2000) (Infection Control and Hospital Epidemiology, 2000;21(5):345-348)
Palaria et.al. Journal of Clinical and Diagnostic Research, 2018;12(9) DC01-DC05.

As an FYI, research enthusiast literally means nothing, other than you've been here a while and post. If it meant anything, it would mean I was an expert, and that's clearly not true.

How utterly self important to insult someone based on the functions of a forum you haven't even taken the time to learn.

 

[Augu5+1ne]

Woah I bet you really wow the kids at parties.

I’m a statistics and science guy who has worked in semiconductor production and bio-pharma production, what have you done?

Let’s break what you said down and what you are implying by linking this study:
- Contamination implies “you are going to have an adverse reaction.” Incorrect on so many levels. Cars can go without an oil change for 30,000 miles and not suffer an adverse reaction. Is that a good idea? No, can you predict each individual responses? No.

- as it’s obvious you don’t really understand statistically relevant versus data, your phone has a HUGE level of contamination, in fact all of our phones probably do (that’s just data). People who have a reaction to this contamination (statistically relevant) is most likely well below 1%, which could be caused by lower immune systems, worse hygiene, already sick, etc.

filters are designed to prevent statistically relevant outcomes that apply to the filtering process (small bacteria/foreign materials existing in the source). Filters are NOT designed to stop re-sticking a vial and the contamination subsequent to that.

The rules of:
- Don’t use BAC water past 30/60 days once punctured
- Don’t use peptides past 30/60 days once reconstituted + punctured
- Clean the cap prior to every stick with alcohol pad

Those rules exist to lower your chance of a statistically relevant event related to contamination which is NORMAL in use.

Many people go well beyond these limits and are just fine, because we make rules based on high risk aversion.

Many fantastic independent studies in this community have been done even on peptide degradation that drastically go over recommended maximum frozen storage levels (2-3 years) proving that risks are relatively low on using product frozen for even 4-5 years. I bet by your thought process there is a 25% chance those people must have keeled over by now

What an obnoxious ass you are. "I’m a statistics and science guy who has worked in semiconductor production and bio-pharma production, what have you done?" - I don't need to appeal to authority or put myself on a pedestal to argue an issue as simple as filtering grey market crud. You would cringe if you learned what I do for a living, but I don't need to talk about myself, just this topic. Rules are bullshit and your wall of text blog is inversely correlated with your lack of knowledge on this topic.

 

[Augu5+1ne]

That was shockingly bad and weird.

I thought maybe he would remove it when he calmed down. Nope.

a fat clown made a clownish post so I called him on it. You, along with a half dozen reddit-tier morons dogpiled on me for making basic safety suggestions - what do you expect - apologies for me standing up for myself?