yea, i donno. i feel like people are going to judge me if i put some of that creme on and wrap myself in saran wrap.I
It's not criticism, we just care about your health
Losing weight fast is perfectly fine, but it can have some complications, so it's more like a heads up than criticism
First they judge you, then they get jealous and join you
very interested in this as all mine is located in my stomach too and I want it gone, figure if all else fails I'll pay for the surgery when I'm at my goal weight if I ever get there (tons to go)
No. He's being reckless with his health. We're all losing weight. There are very serious risks to doing it too fast.First they judge you, then they get jealous and join you
Yea, we don't want him to hurt himself while he is taking advice from internet strangers. There's really dangerous crap you can buy that can cause irreversible organ damage.
I was joking about the plastic wrap specifically. I've made several direct comments to @raw_oyster_eater already so I think he knows where I stand.
Tbh, you should edit that comment so no one decides to google and buy it
It's poisonWhile I do agree that it might seem reckless based on the information we have, that doesn't have to be true. If your macros and micros are on point and you don't have any underlying conditions you can lose weight rather quickly without causing much harm at all, it's also very individual.
just do that!!!
We've been watching his story from the beginning. I promise you his macros are not on point.
While he may be a vendor he never pushes his product. Nothing in that post suggests he’s trying to sell. You’re just trying to stir things up.
It's a completely fair point to make, I do have a vendor tag after all
That said, I think any advice given by strangers online should be carefully considered whether they are from a vendor or not. 
As for my motive, I would be lying if I said I'm not on here to sell products. But the products I'm selling here is weight loss peptides, not steroids - And the vendor section is the place to do that.
www.health.harvard.edu
The reason I lumped steroids in with peptides, is that there are quite a few peptides that can also cause quite severe harm and are still in early research stages so there are many unknowns. I often get a feeling that people tend to consider all peptides as harmless as Sema and Tirz (But I could be wrong).
Testosterone in normal doses can also worsen sleep apnea and heart failure. In obese folks it is converted to estrogen by aromatase leading to other potential cardiac risk …..and breast growth. EtcIt's a completely fair point to make, I do have a vendor tag after all
And I would hope that people do their own research and read up before injecting anything into their body.
Appreciate the kind words
As for my motive, I would be lying if I said I'm not on here to sell products. But the products I'm selling here is weight loss peptides, not steroids - And the vendor section is the place to do that.
Other places on the board I just read and engage in order to learn and share knowledge/experience (Whether you agree with what I say or not is up to you). Long term I believe that's more beneficial than pushing products.
When it comes to steroids, they do have quite a bad rep because they are more often abused than used, usually without proper management - But that doesn't mean they don't have upsides if used correctly.
Steroid use is probably a lot more common than you think, it's just that everyone using them doesn't look like the hulk - quite few steroid users do actually.
Not saying abusing steroids for bigger muscles is a good thing, I'm no fan of the fitness industry, but it is what it is and some of us are happy to take that risk. Objectively that's a silly decision, but that can be said for a lot of things people do
I specifically mentioned a low dosage, testosterone since it's one of the safer options for maintaining muscle mass on a prolonged calorie deficit. I could argue that anavar and hgh (debatable) might serve the purpose too with a low chance of side effects - If the dosing isn't stupid.
Does that mean I think everyone should start taking testosterone?
Definitely not (well, depends - but that's off topic for this discussion)...
There are several potential complications, and overweight can increase those risks, antiatherogenic lipid profile, blood pressure, sleep apnea, aromatase and estrogen related side effects etc.
"Also testosterone is known to stimulate growth of prostate cancer in men diagnosed with the condition. Recent clinical trials, which provide more accurate information compared to observational studies, have provided some comfort around both the heart and prostate cancer risks. For men who clearly have testosterone deficiency, there is no apparent increased risk of heart attack or stroke or greater chance of developing a new prostate cancer from testosterone replacement therapy."
Is testosterone therapy safe? Take a breath before you take the plunge - Harvard Health
The marketing of therapy for low testosterone highlights the short-term benefits, like increased energy, mental sharpness, and improved sexual function. But serious concerns remain about potential ...
Oral steroids and rapid weight-loss is probably not a great idea without doing some blood tests since both puts stress on the liver.
I'd also like to point out that there are several steroids that would serve the purpose better, but they come with a way higher risk of side effects, which is why I haven't mentioned them.
My opinion is more biased because of personal opinions, use and experience than it is from a financial incentive - There are other places to peddle steroids that are way more suited for the purpose than this forum
The reason I lumped steroids in with peptides, is that there are quite a few peptides that can also cause quite severe harm and are still in early research stages so there are many unknowns. I often get a feeling that people tend to consider all peptides as harmless as Sema and Tirz (But I could be wrong).
The way you phrased yourself here, basically underlines that point - even if that wasn't what you intended to say. I would argue that a low dose of testosterone (trt dosages) is probably a lot safer and less problematic than some, if not all GHS peptides for example.
I don't think anyone should inject anything into their body without reading up, understanding risk/reward and preferably consulting a doctor and take the proper precautions. People are different and react differently to various medicine after all.
It's also worth mentioning that some peoples red blood cell count goes wild even on lower doses of testosterone, and more or less everyone will have an increased count - Which can increase the chance of clotting, and needs to be managed - for example by donating blood.
So yes, completely unsupervised use is not recommended at all. But under proper management I am tempted to call it harmless for the majority of people.
But I'll take what you said into account and make sure that I mention monitoring whenever I mention steroids.
A quick disclaimer: I'm not trying to say steroids are harmless, they most definitely are not. And the risks increase significantly with increased BMI, but that does not mean that they can't serve a purpose. I simply stated that it is a way to retain muscle mass when losing weight, and it can be managed quite safely (In most cases).
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
www.medicalnewstoday.com
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
No, I'm making sure people know what they are reading. I didn't say he was lying about anything, just that he has an obvious bias.
Aromatase activity is greatly increased in obesity. A large amount of the injected testosterone will convert to estrogen. Estrogen - estradiol increase causes gynecomastia directly. Also prostate enlargement... Smarter to use an aromatase inhibitor . Also most obese folks have low total testosterone. So every research study will have a low total testosterone patient if obese. A total testosterone means nothing in an obese patient . A free/ bioavailable is better. Low total testosterone in the obese doesn’t mean they need replacement. The sleep apnea risk isn’t just from lack of muscle tone but also enlargement of tongue plays a role. Testosterone increase fluid retention and that is bad for the heart…if you have cardiac problems . Many obese do and don’t know it. Just been prescribing it for 15 years or so and have seen the many, many troubles with improperA quick disclaimer: I'm not trying to say steroids are harmless, they most definitely are not. And the risks increase significantly with increased BMI, but that does not mean that they can't serve a purpose. I simply stated that it is a way to retain muscle mass when losing weight, and it can be managed quite safely (In most cases).
There are studies that indicate positive effects treating obesity with trt. I would consider them inconclusive for now, but it does give me enough reason to question whether trt is a bad idea for an obese man with low T.
Effectiveness of testosterone therapy in obese men with low testosterone levels, for losing weight, controlling obesity complications, and preventing cardiovascular events: Protocol of a systematic review of randomized controlled trials - PMC
Supplemental Digital Content is available in the text Keywords: low testosterone, metabolic syndrome, obesity, testosterone therapy, type 2 diabetes mellitus, weight loss
https://endocrinenews.endocrine.org/the-long-haul-treating-men-with-obesity-with-testosterone/#:~:text=A study presented at ENDO,mortality or major cardiovascular incidents.&text=Obesity – a complex physiological disorder,common in men with hypogonadism. (Unsure about this source to be fair)
Heart failure:
Show me a conclusive study backing up your claim of heart failure. The observational studies you are most likely referring to are not solid enough, and over 10 years old.
There are also studies showing that the risk is increased by a low baseline level of testosterone and can potentially be amended by trt.
Some recent studies shows no difference in the risk of adverse cardiovascular events in men taking the therapy versus those not taking it. Arrhythmia risk may be slightly higher while on testosterone replacement though.
Basically, it's inconclusive.
Testosterone and the Heart - PMC
Testosterone (T) has a number of important effects on the cardiovascular system. In men, T levels begin to decrease after age 40, and this decrease has been associated with an increase in all-cause mortality and cardiovascular (CV) risk. Low T ...
Heart health: Low testosterone associated with higher mortality risk
Researchers say low testosterone levels in men can increase mortality risk and very low levels of testosterone can increase the risk of cardiovascular-related death
The Effect of Testosterone on Cardiovascular Disease and Cardiovascular Risk Factors in Men: A Review of Clinical and Preclinical Data - PMC
Cardiovascular disease (CVD) is the leading cause of death worldwide. The effects of testosterone, the primary male sex hormone, on cardiovascular risk have been of special interest due to the increased risk of CVD in men. Although it is well ...
How Low Testosterone Affects the Heart
Low sex drive and declining muscle mass aren't the only reasons to prevent low T.www.houstonmethodist.org
Sleep apnea caused by testosterone is quite individual and random, and risk increases with dosage. But yes, obesity will increase this risk.
Estrogen/Aromatase:
All people turn testosterone into estrogen via aromatase, not just obese folks - An increase of aromatase is associated with the inflammatory response in adipose tissue caused by obesity.
You can manage aromatase with an AI. Though in some cases obesity, due to aromatase-mediated androgen conversion into estradiol in the peripheral adipose tissue, might impair AI inhibitory capacity.
It's worth to mention that this risk would be present with or without exogenous testosterone. But might be slightly increased by testosterone if left unmanaged, I'm unsure if there are any studies on that specifically.
Breast growth:
Again, still a risk without trt, probably marginally increased by trt, again unsure if there are studies on the topic.Adolescent gynecomastia is associated with a high incidence of obesity, dysglycemia, and family background of diabetes mellitus - PMC
Gynecomastia during adolescence is common though etiology is not clear. We studied the clinical and hormonal profile of adolescent patients with gynecomastia. Patients who had onset of breast development between age 10 and 20 years were included in ...
Sleep apnea:
Having low testosterone leads to lower muscle mass and a higher BMI, both of which are risk factors for sleep apnea. However, the reverse is also true. High testosterone levels are also correlated with an increased risk of sleep apnea.
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It's not like I'm saying he should take testosterone. I just mentioned that it is a potential solution to a concern he has. If you know what you're doing (or preferably consult a specialist), it may or may not be manageable depending on your situation.
According to your knowledge I should be dead 5-10 years ago
But all my health checkups are perfectly fine - that includes long term heart rate monitoring.
I also attended a study a couple years ago where they did god knows how many tests, from cognitive tests to mri, contrast agent, bloodwork and so on and so on. Perfectly healthy, and the list of stuff I have injected in my body (some in stupid amounts when young and dumb) is long.
That does NOT mean that there are no risks, not by a long shot. And higher doses do not have any upsides except big muscles - but there are more colors than black and white.
To be fair, you are probably better off health wise by not taking ANY kind of medication you don't need. But if you look around, that isn't really what happens in practice.
If you dive down the rabbit hole, there are actually quite a few health benefits from trt (depending on situation and dosage). Most of those could probably be achieved with a clean and healthy diet and exercise though, depending slightly on age and genetics.
I can't argue when it's phrased like that
Would like the post twice if I could.
maybe. not too bad.
Not necessarily in what you're taking but in how you're treating it. (although just completely jumping way ahead in dosing schedules and mixing glp1s isn't great) But you're using them to enable an abysmal diet and blow off everyone who told you it was bad idea. Not focusing on muscle retention isn't unique to you however. A lot of people aren't taking that serious enough.
